Shop Talk
Verizon Reps ... Is this you ... welcome to infamy
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Those Verizon reps made me 🤣 and 😢
Basic math. That's all it was and none of them got it.
Basic math. That's all it was and none of them got it.
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But but the computer calculates the costs for them and it's never wrong!
Their dependence on computers is quite obvious when none of them were capable of understanding that different units represent different amounts.
They could recognize the difference between 1 cent and 1 dollar, but not fractions of 1 cent and fractions of 1 dollar.
Their dependence on computers is quite obvious when none of them were capable of understanding that different units represent different amounts.
They could recognize the difference between 1 cent and 1 dollar, but not fractions of 1 cent and fractions of 1 dollar.
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If I were him, I would have asked her to write down .002 and then write down .00002
Then ask her if the two were different.. relate to her that they're both expressed in dollars... with the one on the right being what youre QUOTING.. and the one on the left is what youre BILLING.
The reps were genuinley trying to assist, but something like this is very difficult to describe over the phone.
His level of defeat is hilarious throughout the call though.. very amusing.
Then ask her if the two were different.. relate to her that they're both expressed in dollars... with the one on the right being what youre QUOTING.. and the one on the left is what youre BILLING.
The reps were genuinley trying to assist, but something like this is very difficult to describe over the phone.
His level of defeat is hilarious throughout the call though.. very amusing.
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More to the point.. at work, we quote people 2 cents per K.
In print, it is written as "$0.02"
That is correct.. so where in the world are they getting $0.00002??!!!
Feels good to know Im not making an issue of something I didnt know could BE an issue.
In print, it is written as "$0.02"
That is correct.. so where in the world are they getting $0.00002??!!!
Feels good to know Im not making an issue of something I didnt know could BE an issue.
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He was quoted a price of .002 cents.
The actual price is .002 dollars.
The units are different. One dollar unit is equal to 100 cent units.
.002 cents * 35,893 = 0.71786 U.S. dollars
.002 dollars * 35,893 = 71.78600 U.S. dollars
See the difference the units of measure make?
Another way to see it, expressed solely in dollars is (note, .002 dollars is the actual price, however, .00002 dollars (aka .002 cents) is the price he was quoted and the price that was notated in his account several times) :
.002 U.S. dollars * 35 893 = 71.78600 U.S. dollars
.00002 dollars * 35,893 = 0.71786 U.S. dollars
Behold, the power of math.
The actual price is .002 dollars.
The units are different. One dollar unit is equal to 100 cent units.
.002 cents * 35,893 = 0.71786 U.S. dollars
.002 dollars * 35,893 = 71.78600 U.S. dollars
See the difference the units of measure make?
Another way to see it, expressed solely in dollars is (note, .002 dollars is the actual price, however, .00002 dollars (aka .002 cents) is the price he was quoted and the price that was notated in his account several times) :
.002 U.S. dollars * 35 893 = 71.78600 U.S. dollars
.00002 dollars * 35,893 = 0.71786 U.S. dollars
Behold, the power of math.
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He was quoted, and it is notated in his account, that the rate was "point zero zero two cents".
It's actually "point zero zero two dollars".
The representatives are extremely painful to listen to. It's not just one, but several who struggle to understand the basic math involved.
What is even more painful about it, is even after having a rudimentary math lesson, the representatives claim that the price is still .002 cents when in fact, they actually charge .002 dollars, all the while not understanding the difference between a dollar and a cent.
It's actually "point zero zero two dollars".
The representatives are extremely painful to listen to. It's not just one, but several who struggle to understand the basic math involved.
What is even more painful about it, is even after having a rudimentary math lesson, the representatives claim that the price is still .002 cents when in fact, they actually charge .002 dollars, all the while not understanding the difference between a dollar and a cent.
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So... after all of them insisting that he would only be charged .002 cents per K, could he get them to change the rate on his account and actually only bill him for that amount? If they're going to insist that's the right price then that's all he should have to pay.
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I know. I know, but try telling them that.
Ralph, you really have to listen to the call to get the full impact of it.
I agree, if they insist the price is .002 cents, then that should be what he is charged.
However, they insist the price .002 cents, yet he is charged 100 times more then he should be if that were the actual price. He is charged .002 dollars.
The sad thing is none of the reps understand that .002 cents is different from .002 dollars, insist that he pay the .002 dollars a kb price of $71.79, and all the while say he is only be charged .002 cents a kb.
002 cents * 35,893 = 0.71786 U.S. dollars
.002 dollars * 35,893 = 71.78600 U.S. dollars
At one time he says "I don't know what I can do to make it any c...
(continues)
Ralph, you really have to listen to the call to get the full impact of it.
I agree, if they insist the price is .002 cents, then that should be what he is charged.
However, they insist the price .002 cents, yet he is charged 100 times more then he should be if that were the actual price. He is charged .002 dollars.
The sad thing is none of the reps understand that .002 cents is different from .002 dollars, insist that he pay the .002 dollars a kb price of $71.79, and all the while say he is only be charged .002 cents a kb.
002 cents * 35,893 = 0.71786 U.S. dollars
.002 dollars * 35,893 = 71.78600 U.S. dollars
At one time he says "I don't know what I can do to make it any c...
(continues)
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I'll listen to it at home. I know it was posted a few days ago but I keep forgetting to check. Since he recorded the whole freaking conversation I'm sure he can get some kind of compensation just for dealing with all that.
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🤣
One of my favorite quotes from the caller.
One of my favorite quotes from the caller.
I'll tell you what the problem is here. Is you... the original person I spoke to before I used my air time, and upto and including you are quoting .002 dollars per kb as if it's .002 cents per kb.
And they are not the same.
So I assumed you guys knew how to do math. No offense here. But I assumed you knew the difference between .002 cents and .002 dollars.
It sounds like there is still some confusion about that.
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What about how the reps keep insisting the price is actually .002 cents despite him showing it's not.
Hell, the supervisor started busting out how many years he had been working there and how long he had been a supervisor, yet he couldn't do simple math or understand the simple concept behind the caller's complaint.
It's sad really. It's like the reps are drones and incapable of thought.
Hell, the supervisor started busting out how many years he had been working there and how long he had been a supervisor, yet he couldn't do simple math or understand the simple concept behind the caller's complaint.
It's sad really. It's like the reps are drones and incapable of thought.
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Funny thing... I think some of the trainers listened to this call cuz now in Training and Winners circle and at least once a week on the floor, they continuously remind us that its .0005 dollars, not .0005 cents. And if you tell somebody that its cents, you have to call the customer back and tell them the right price or you get written up for behavioral.
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🤣
At least they are finally realizing there is difference between fractions of dollars versus cents.
At least they are finally realizing there is difference between fractions of dollars versus cents.
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Really? The guy could not have explained it any better then he already had several times.
The representatives could not do simple conversions from dollars to cents. They could not or did not understand a basic math principle taught to children.
The caller was even smart enough to have the price quoted to him notated in his account and they notated it as fractions of a cent, and not as fractions of a dollar
This call is reaching AOL Vincent Ferrari fame.
The representatives could not do simple conversions from dollars to cents. They could not or did not understand a basic math principle taught to children.
The caller was even smart enough to have the price quoted to him notated in his account and they notated it as fractions of a cent, and not as fractions of a dollar
This call is reaching AOL Vincent Ferrari fame.
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🤣
I've recorded a few of my conversations in the past for public posting, however, I always chicken out on pulling the trigger.
If you thought that call was a doozy, you'd be dumbstruck with a few that I have experienced.
I've recorded a few of my conversations in the past for public posting, however, I always chicken out on pulling the trigger.
If you thought that call was a doozy, you'd be dumbstruck with a few that I have experienced.
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This sounds amazing. I wish I could listen at work...I'll have to remember to check this once I get home ^_^
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For reading more and finding out if he ever gets a resolution you can check out his blog at:
http://verizonmath.blogspot.com/ »
Also, I had to include this quote, it's near the end of the call.
http://verizonmath.blogspot.com/ »
Also, I had to include this quote, it's near the end of the call.
Andrea: Floor Manager, discussing .002 cents being the same as .002 dollars
"well its obviously a difference of opinion"
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Friday, December 8, 2006
Dear George Vaccaro,
Hi George. My name is Nikki and I understand your frustration regarding the data charges on your bill. I am happy to assist you today.
I sincerely apologize for the inconvenience and confusion this has caused. Per the remarks in the account, I have found that the customer service representative provided the correct pricing information. However; due to the miscommunication, I am willing to credit half of the data charges which would be $-36.00. Please reply to this email if you would like to accept this offer.
It has been a pleasure assisting you today, and we appreciate your business. Should you have additional questions or concerns, please reply to this e-mail.
Sincerely,
Nikki...
(continues)
Dear George Vaccaro,
Hi George. My name is Nikki and I understand your frustration regarding the data charges on your bill. I am happy to assist you today.
I sincerely apologize for the inconvenience and confusion this has caused. Per the remarks in the account, I have found that the customer service representative provided the correct pricing information. However; due to the miscommunication, I am willing to credit half of the data charges which would be $-36.00. Please reply to this email if you would like to accept this offer.
It has been a pleasure assisting you today, and we appreciate your business. Should you have additional questions or concerns, please reply to this e-mail.
Sincerely,
Nikki...
(continues)
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Nikkie, Verizon Wireless
...I have found that the customer service representative provided the correct pricing information. However; due to the miscommunication, I am willing to credit half of the data charges...
I think Nikki must be a man, cause it took balls to write that.
Seriously though, that is some strong Kool-Aid.
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This is great exactly why i quit cs at verizon no ones on the same page stupid ass policy that no ONE including stupid supervisors can understand i want to add this call as my ringtone 😁
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I think the issue is --- now I am just speaking for myself and maybe others but they never taught us in school .002 dollars i guess people are on a 1 mind track when you put that . they are on a cent mind
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well it would be fine if it was 2 cents. but when you add another tenth it becomes something entirely different. If it was .02 that would be 2 cents. but .002 you have to distinguish if it is .002 of a dollar or .002 of a cent. Two different things!
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the CS rep, the supervisor, and the floor manager were retarded. They see a difference. I think it is pretty obvious that dollars and cents are 100x different. He couldn't have made the math more clear.
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vzwinagent
Everyone here is wrong. It is .002 cents and that does equal dollars when multiplyed by the usage. There is no such thing as .002 dollars. Math is never done that way.
https://www.phonescoop.com/carriers/forum.php?fm=m&f ... »
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Okay, is this person and everyone else really that dumb? There really isn't a such thing as .002 dollars. I mean there is, and you could figure it, but it's not what is being talking about here. Anything money wise after a point is in cents. If you take .002 cents and multiply it by the usage you get the total in dollars. It would only be cents if the total was still on the right of the decimal. The number turns in to dollars because it is a whole number on the left of the decimal. The call is a complete idiot. You don't convert cents to dollars and dollars to cents. Money is one thing. There the 35000 whatever usage times .002 cents equals that many dollars.
https://www.phonescoop.com/carriers/forum.php »...
(continues)
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wow, I really can't believe this. how on earth can't they figure out that .002 cents is .00002 dollars. This is like 5th grade math.
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OMGICBVHMOTRWCDM
Oh
My
Goodness
I
Can't
Believe
Verizon
Has
More
Of
These
Reps
Who
Can't
Do
Math
Oh
My
Goodness
I
Can't
Believe
Verizon
Has
More
Of
These
Reps
Who
Can't
Do
Math
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Wow, don't tell any of my DID providers that fractions of cents don't exist, I would throw a fit if I had to start paying more than $0.001/min lol
I can see it now... "Why is my bill $80,000 for xxx-xxx-xxxx? when usage is $0.001/min? The most possible at this rate is $44.64 per channel...That would be continuous use on 1792 channels!"
"well $0.001 is the same as $100 because people just don't do math that way"
:-/
I can see it now... "Why is my bill $80,000 for xxx-xxx-xxxx? when usage is $0.001/min? The most possible at this rate is $44.64 per channel...That would be continuous use on 1792 channels!"
"well $0.001 is the same as $100 because people just don't do math that way"
:-/
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Plooky: Below is the text from his blog with an explanation of his resolution and thanks to the internet in general followed by his letter response from Verizon, where they finally use units of measure correctly.
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Hi everyone. Look what just rolled into my inbox.
There are a few things in the email that I don't quite understand, that make me think this was a very carefully, even overly crafted document.
First, notice the awkward wording of "a previous representative has credited for." Credited what? How about "credited your account for?"
Also, whats all this about a "previous representative" altogether? The previous represetative AFAIK was Nikki, and I had no other correspondence with ...
(continues)
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Hi everyone. Look what just rolled into my inbox.
There are a few things in the email that I don't quite understand, that make me think this was a very carefully, even overly crafted document.
First, notice the awkward wording of "a previous representative has credited for." Credited what? How about "credited your account for?"
Also, whats all this about a "previous representative" altogether? The previous represetative AFAIK was Nikki, and I had no other correspondence with ...
(continues)
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ha! The man folds in the end. What about in the usa is it still .002 dollars or cents?
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In the letter they send him they state:
In the future please keep in mind that it is .002 dollars per KB while in Canada.
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What they should really do is say it is .2 cents/kb the zero's make it messy.
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.2 cents? how about 2 cents... w/o the decimal? it's not the zeros messing ppl up, it's the needless use of the decimal... besides... that rep wrote that it's still 2/10ths of a cent per KB while in canada... 🤨
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It's not 2 cents though. It's .2 cents. 2/10 of a cent. Two-tenths on a penny.
The decimal is required unless you want them to bust out fractions. Then all hell will break loose.
The decimal is required unless you want them to bust out fractions. Then all hell will break loose.
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Actually the decimal is just another way of representing a fraction 😁
Decimals and fractions are interchangeable.
.5 = 1/2
Decimals and fractions are interchangeable.
.5 = 1/2
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I know that plookmeister.
But if you think these people have troubles with a decimal point. Let them try and figure out which number to increase or decrease within a fraction. Their heads will just explode.
But if you think these people have troubles with a decimal point. Let them try and figure out which number to increase or decrease within a fraction. Their heads will just explode.
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Man, I'm sorry you had to deal with all that, I am a VZW rep and I know that I have quoted people the .002 cents not even paying attention to what I was saying. I am very well aware there is a difference and if you had gotten a hold of me I would have credited you on the spot. And furthermore, any customer that calls in in the future with this on their account disputing the charges I will give them the credit because I know how prevalent the problem is. Everybody quotes that rate for kilobytes and I have never even thought twice about it.
Just a little fyi while we are on the topic of misquoting units. While in training for data everybody quotes the network speed as MegaBYTES per second and KiloBYTES per second as opposed to how network ...
(continues)
Just a little fyi while we are on the topic of misquoting units. While in training for data everybody quotes the network speed as MegaBYTES per second and KiloBYTES per second as opposed to how network ...
(continues)
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After looking up some info I found that the price is as follows, really no clarification
$0.002/kb OR 1 MB=$2.00
Sorry that you were told that, they should have looked further to see the MB allowance and explained it that way.
$0.002/kb OR 1 MB=$2.00
Sorry that you were told that, they should have looked further to see the MB allowance and explained it that way.
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On the bright side, Verizonwireless Corporate went ahead and sent a blanket e-mail describing how the system works and not to describe it as .002 cents, so atleast people will be educated and know what to do going forward.
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I'm doubt it... with people like this around
https://www.phonescoop.com/carriers/forum.php?fm=m&f ... »
I tried to explain it again to him carefully, but it didn't get across.
https://www.phonescoop.com/carriers/forum.php?fm=m&f ... »
I tried to explain it again to him carefully, but it didn't get across.
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😕 To better phrase it: Most of the representatives will understand and be able to explain it better, atleast in my area. The information they sent out to us was quite lengthy. 😳
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Also, the math was bad, sure... but where's the harm here? In the end, VZW credited the entire overage off the bill. Steps have been taken to ensure this doesn't happen too much in the future. Even when you know the difference between 2 tenths of a cent and two thousandths of a cent, it's kind of easy to misstate that. I'm definitely not defending stupidity, particularly stupidity that stays there when you escalate, but in the end this is really not a lot more than yet another trolling thread by an old, well-known troll.
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I am so cool 😎 I work for a different company....buuut everytime i have to talk to a customer regarding money and something ending in cents I make sure i say of a dollar....
ie -
Customer asked about long distance it is 15 cents but I was like ohhh its 15 cents of a dollar.....confused em...made me giggle...and i make sure that i tell them it is part of a dollar and i note accounts like this now $0.15/min
😎 🤣 😎
ie -
Customer asked about long distance it is 15 cents but I was like ohhh its 15 cents of a dollar.....confused em...made me giggle...and i make sure that i tell them it is part of a dollar and i note accounts like this now $0.15/min
😎 🤣 😎
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.002 dollars, and .002 cents CANNOT be the same amount. .002 dollars is in fact 2/10ths of a cent. .002 cents is 2/1000ths of a cent.
the whole problem is that everyone seems to be ignoring the fact that you are using the same decimal notation for two DIFFERENT units of measure.
we can read it differently by calling .002 dollars, 2/1000ths of a dollar.
and by reading .002 cents, as 2/1000ths of a cent. does that explain the difference in the unit of measure at all? 2/1000ths of a cent is not the same as 2/1000ths of a dollar right?
lets learn to convert number properly now...
if it takes 100 cents to make a dollar(and it does, i assure you), then that means that it takes 100,000/1000ths of a cent to make a dollar. So in...
(continues)
the whole problem is that everyone seems to be ignoring the fact that you are using the same decimal notation for two DIFFERENT units of measure.
we can read it differently by calling .002 dollars, 2/1000ths of a dollar.
and by reading .002 cents, as 2/1000ths of a cent. does that explain the difference in the unit of measure at all? 2/1000ths of a cent is not the same as 2/1000ths of a dollar right?
lets learn to convert number properly now...
if it takes 100 cents to make a dollar(and it does, i assure you), then that means that it takes 100,000/1000ths of a cent to make a dollar. So in...
(continues)
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I can't believe people actually believe dollars and cents are the samething and have the nerve to call themselves intelligent. Your education from 3rd grade forward needs to be revoked. LMAO
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The level of stupidity and incompetence demonstrated by those backing the rep on the call both within Verizon and in this forum is incomprehensible.
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I can't believe this post got so big as to have VZW need to put a clarification out on InfoCenter regarding this. Its funny though. When I saw the post put up on InfoCenter about it I about fell out of my chair laughing. 🤣
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VzwRsR, Dec 14, 7:16 AM
If the subject content was not complex to rep he was speaking to why did he change the "examples" before asking the same question to a answer he obvously allready knew. In fact i purpose that he made that call with the express intention of argueing his way out of a bill he was more than likely aware he was going to recieve
Apparently VzwRsR feels that grade school math is complex, and receiving a bill for 100 times the price you were quoted is being nitpicky.
🤣
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That was absolutely the most painful listening experience I have ever been subjected to. Every one of the "reps" involved should lose their job. They are an embarrassment to mankind. It is a wonder they know how to breath on their own.
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I agree....I know that if a customer starts to speak as I am speaking I have to stop speaking to let the customer speak --- no matter what because we do not want to over speak the customer......the manager kept overtalking the customer....i was just like what?! a manager?!
also the fact that she said "i dont know im not a mathmatician" really? like that was not obvious
also the fact that she said "i dont know im not a mathmatician" really? like that was not obvious
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When is this supposed to be published in the Times? I'm not looking forward to that, it's going to make our jobs harder
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Here is a reply to a post from the verizonmath blog that George started... I wanted to re-post this, because it re-iterates that THIS whole situation is NOT Verizon Reps being stupid, OR Verizon Wireless systems quoting the incorrect price in their databases that the reps get the information from (which, I can tell you 100%, by the way, DO say $0.002), but a subject of the larger part of the general population looking at units the wrong way.
Here it is...
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SirBrianTheLion said...
Being in telecom for 20 years now, I have dealt with partial penny rates for years & this is a common infraction (which still doesn't make it acceptable). AT&T (SBC) sells local usage in WI at $.0082 per minute. Most every...
(continues)
Here it is...
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SirBrianTheLion said...
Being in telecom for 20 years now, I have dealt with partial penny rates for years & this is a common infraction (which still doesn't make it acceptable). AT&T (SBC) sells local usage in WI at $.0082 per minute. Most every...
(continues)
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Capt. Plooky, this issue was resolved to your satisfaction, right? You got the credit you asked for, if I read it right.
It is unfortunate that folks assume anyone working at a call center to be rocket scientist...unless you're calling NASA's call center.
While the error was made, and it is an "easy" error to make, you have been made whole. I agree a little more attention to detail needs to be made because after all, words do mean things, as well as numbers.
As most of us in this industry know, we deal in a lot of "grey areas" when it comes to billing, credits, charges, etc. There is discretion depending on who you speak with, how you speak and what you say. I'm glad your issue was resolved but am sorry it happened, especially s...
(continues)
It is unfortunate that folks assume anyone working at a call center to be rocket scientist...unless you're calling NASA's call center.
While the error was made, and it is an "easy" error to make, you have been made whole. I agree a little more attention to detail needs to be made because after all, words do mean things, as well as numbers.
As most of us in this industry know, we deal in a lot of "grey areas" when it comes to billing, credits, charges, etc. There is discretion depending on who you speak with, how you speak and what you say. I'm glad your issue was resolved but am sorry it happened, especially s...
(continues)
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It was settled by Verizon, but not by some of the people on these forums. Some people still don't get it, which makes me wanna off myself after reading it.
They're that dense.
They're that dense.
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Yep...there's more stuff to do than to beat a dead horse...
Beat a dead horse...hmmm
Gotta go.
Beat a dead horse...hmmm
Gotta go.
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