verizon SAID they are the most reliable........THEY HAVE PRESENTED NO EVIDENCE 😕

point is all claims are JUST claims..........cingular aint in major Schit now or yet so why is their such a big problem.

ALL carriers do it........SHOW me proof VZW is the most reliable, show me proof with T-MOBILE you get more, show me proof with SPRINT all calls are clear..................

There is a study that shows that Verizon leads all other carriers, with T-mobile a close second. It was made by the independent and prestigious Consumer Reports.

They, unlike Telephia, have posted data available to their subscribers that shows Verizon and T-mobile leading other carriers in several areas such as dropped calls, static, etc.
That is as of September 2005.
Cingular leads in NONE of the cities covered in the study.
And we also have JD Powers, who combined data from October 2005 and February 2006, and found that T-mobile leads in 6 regions (5 ties with verizon) and verizon leads in 5 regions (all tied with t-mobile):
http://www.jdpower.com/pdf/2006059.pdf »

If one thing is certain about these reports, is that Cingular provi...
(continues)

Must we get into this everytime some new idiot logs into phonescoop and complains about a commercial they saw..... fact is that Consumer Reports/JD Power did not do any testing, their claims are based on customer surveys, repeat with me, customer surveys, not actual testing. Telephia, does actual road testing of each carrier, so while you may not agree with their findings, questioning the validity of Cingular's claims and then backing up Verizon's claims with nothing more than 5000 peoples opinions of carriers is a joke. Please, next time before posting something, read the 50 other posts exactly like it and figure out that you are a complete fool before wasting our time (and space).

You tell me to re-read phonescoop before commenting, but you refuse to read the actual number of participants in those studies before telling the lie that "nothing more than 5000 peoples" participated in these studies.
For your information, my misinformed misinforming friend, the JD Power and associates study is based on responses from 22,871 wireless users.
And the latest Consumer Reports study surveyed 50,000 cell users.

I like you because you screw up the facts and the stats so bad and so often that i feel more than glad to correct you.

A few questions:
Who said Telephia didn't do testing?
Why do you act like you know what Telephia's test revealed?
Telephia clearly expressed its confusion after learning that Ci...
(continues)

But it looks like you are the one that does not re-read the thread before posting, because I already embarrassed a JD Powers doubter when I provided this link to Cingular's website, in which Cingular is bragging about having excelled in one region in a study made by...guess who? JD Power!!!

Who did you embarrass?! NOBODY! 🤣

For the third and final time. A company does not have to put faith in the information they put out as a press release! That information was good PR for Cingular whether they put faith in the study or not. A company will always brag about the "good stuff" no matter what it is.

The fact that you admit that it was good PR tells you about JD Powers prestige. If it's good PR it means the public trusts JD Powers. Otherwise Cingular would not see it as "good PR" as you say. You would say this is not true, and i would say it's common sense.

And when the next JD Powers study comes out, people who are reading this thread will not see any reason to regard it as flawed, since nothing has been presented here to believe it's not trustworthy.

Lies?

What Telephia said is they did not know what specific stats Cingular used of all the data provided from their study. Spin masters like yourself will turn that into "we do not know how they came to that conclusion because it is not true".

Now who is lying?

Telephia said nothing you are implying.

It's funny that in the process of trying to call me a spinner, you added words that I never used, such as "because it is not true", at the end.

I never said it's not true.
It is not proven. and it hurts you that it's not proven.
I clearly stated that the truth will be brought to light during the lawsuit.
Remember the part when I said I hoped the data is leaked to the media?
I know you remember, but you are a spinner, so you selectively ignore information that will prove you wrong.

I have not once tried to prove anything you moron. I simply point out your misleading statements.

Nope. My statements were not misleading. Your statement implying that I said Cingular's claim was not true, (when I said it is unproven and will be proven in court) is what is misleading.

Your saying Verizon(not attacking here, just using this as an example) has stats to prove it's most reliable campaign... what you have is testing that is done internal... any company can do that. Who's to say the stats weren't altered to fit what they wanted.

It's all about perception. If X company says they are the most reliable for 2 yrs straight, consumers tend to believe what they see on TV. So of course, when they are called to do a survey by JD, they are going to state what they saw on TV because they've heard it so much....

Everyone is going to have their own opinion, which is what's great about free market society. If one carrier isn't working for you, then you try another one.

how is it exactly not proven?

if a rep of telephia came out and said it would that prove it for you?

i understand what you mean in all about telephia not giving up the results in all. however dont you think if it was such a big deal to vzw, t-mo, sprint, the public, that the other carriers woul be all for buying these results and sharing them?

im pretty sure if vzw wanted to know how they faired against cingular or all the others they buy them or reverse for any other carrier.

A Telephia representative alerady said something, and that was:

Cingular had a "statistically significant lower dropped-call rate than the competition across some market/time period groupings."

and also

Telephia also said it had "no knowledge of the specific methodology (markets, time periods or statistical thresholds) Cingular used to reach the nationwide 'lowest dropped call' conclusion."

Someone noted (I don't remember if it was you or someone else) that "some" could mean any amount. It could mean 2 out of 10 regions, it could mean 8 out of 10, which would be great for Cingular. But we are not told how many, therefore it's not been proven.

Some might choose to blindly b...
(continues)

I think it should be noted that 50,000 people is less then the population of any single major city in the US. This is certainly not a good cross section of the MILLIONS of wireless users in every STATE. So before you laud the reputations of JD Power or Consumer Reports remember that it is actual field hardware and software testing that yields significant and accurate findings.

Also bear in mind that when doing a "survey" of wireless users you are dealing with people and as we all know some days you love your carrier and others you can't stand it.

The reason Telephia doesnt just post the info out in the open is b/c they sell their findings to companies....so lets take a second and think this through....If I'm a company that makes my business by selling the findings from my tests to companies, would it make much sense to publish those findings for everyone? Hmmmm..... now I'm not Donald Trump, but that sounds like a pretty dumb way to run a business.... once again, do a little research (all you had to do was look through this forum to see that Telephia sells their findings to companies) and use a little common sense, and maybe, just maybe, you wont look like such an idiot when you feel like typing something on phonescoop next time 🙂

Posting that illogical reply was a bad idea, asiatic, considering that:

1)I never criticized Telephia for not posting their data. I simply pointed out that CR and JD Powers have information of their studies available, and Telephia doesn't. We cannot draw any conclusions about Telephia's study on a Nationwide basis.

2) I believe you when you say you are not Donald Trump. Donny would be bankrupt if he used your reasoning:
You tried to guess what constitutes "a dumb way to run a business", but you ignore the fact that JD Powers does exactly what you describe as "not a good way to run a business". They post their data first, and after the firm's study results are published, cell phone carriers can choose whether or not to purchase these ...
(continues)

somebody please kill this thread! 🙄

Prestigious Consumer Reports? The same consumer reports that knocked Bose on a "study" when Bose would not cough up a sample pair for free?

1/10th of 1% of users in only 20 cities nationwide? Than is not data, that is a survey. Did they actually test these stats or was is based on consumer experience? Exactly.

I personally believe Verizon is a very good service, but this "my study is more legit than your study" is the biggest 5th grade argument out there.

Get a life guys.

You swear you discovered America when you say it was a survey. But I knew it was a survey and I posted a message making it clear that I knew it was a survey.
The most flawed comment in your last message was to imply that 1/10th of a group is not a big enough sample.
Haha! Show me a survey in which everyone is surveyed.
Political surveys, for example, are made with 500-1000 people, in a population of millions of voters.

NO SURVEYS use samples in which all members of a group or even half the participants are surveyed. And the sad part is that you know this.

And believe me. If a majority among thousands of people say Verizon and T-Mobile drop more calls than Cingular, I will not trust Cingular, and most people who read the study will...
(continues)

Do you even know with whom you are trying to argue? Do you think I am someone else?

Embarrassed? Ummm, no. I dont base my life on this stuff like folks here do.

yes. I was talking about you.

I hope you trash Cingular for not surveying millions of men and women who use wireless.
Cingular made a survey that "Reveals Men Talk 35% More Than Women" and the sample used was....

...1021 qualified adult wireless user respondents(gasp). 😲

How can it be possible?!!!
. That sounds not only less than your 1/10th figure, but less than 1/100th!!!

Bad, bad, Cingular. (according to texaswireless).

Must have hit a nerve. Glad I prodded the right spot.

Typical response of those who can't come up with a good answer:

I must have hit a nerve

Ok, how about this answer then.

STFU!

WOOF! WOOF! 😡 URGGGGGGG WOOF! 😡

Being one of the millions of people with Cingular does not mean that you like the Cingular service. You are not counting those that choose not to cancel the service because of the cancellation fee, and wait until the last day of the membership to switch to a good carrier.
Your 56 million people theory is misleading, just like Cingular's fewest dropped call claim.

Good looking out kings, good point too.

How could it be a smart move when Telephia says it does not know how Cingular reached their conclusion that they had the fewest dropped calls nationwide?
It would be a smart move if Telephia confirmed this claim, instead of denying any knowledge of it.

The point is, Cingular is standing by their claims. They are SUING another company to:

1. Prove that their claims are accurate
2. Prove that the other guys (Sprint, in particular) are the ones that are full of it

Besides, the quote you keep pulling from a certain article is being taken out of context. Telephia will not make claim to any of the results because the results have to be bought. Should Verizon, Sprint, and T-Mobile get the results for free? No.

Oh wait. so Cingular is right because they are SUING somebody? lmao!!!

Anyway, Telephia was not taken out of context. When you have NO KNOWLEDGE of something, you have NO KNOWLEDGE of something.
If Telephia was, like you said, trying to protect their study in order to be able to get money from it, they would have said that they COULD NOT tell the reporter what Cingular's conclusion was based on.

I'll eat my words if Cingular loses that lawsuit.

You can eat yours when they win. 😉

🤣

Already opening wide?

Wow dude dont get all dungeon and dragons on me with the "troll" comment...lol...just leaving a comment...isnt that what these forums are for?

Everyone is making churn-rate commentes without providing proof. Not saying you are lying, but that some of you may be lying.

Gladly.

Verizon--1.18%
http://news.vzw.com/news/2006/05/pr2006-05-18.html »

Cingular--1.9%
http://cingular.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=press_rele ... »

If you click on the link to Verizon's churn, you'll see a list of the national carrier's churn rates by ranking. You'll also find that Cingular is indeed the second lowest in the industry.

Followed then by Sprint, and finally T-Mobile.

It's funny how T-Mobile has won Consumer Reports and JD Powers awards alongside Verizon for network quality, yet they have the highest churn of the nationals. Shows how much faith you can put into twisted consumer surveys like that... 🙄

consumer reports study was made before these churn rates numbers you cited. And churn rates have to do with many factors, including customer service, price, the fact that many people choose their phone by the looks and not by the reception (young teenagers for ex.) etc.

Heh, you never said. Do you believe me now, or do you dtill think I could be lying? 😉

show me where I told you you could be lying.

https://www.phonescoop.com/carriers/forum.php?fm=m&f ... »

That says it pretty plainly.

"...some of you may be lying."

Hello Mr. Some, how are you doing today?

Do you realize that you replied to my churn rate post?

This is what you said in repsonse to my post:

Everyone is making churn-rate commentes without providing proof. Not saying you are lying, but that some of you may be lying.

That would lead anyone to believe that you are particularly targeting the person you repsonded to, which in this case was me. 😳

You are flip-flopping.
In one different post, you argued that we cannot know what the word "some" means or refers to.

However, now, when I asked you to show me when I accused YOU of possibly lying, you pointed out to my claim that "some" of you may be lying.

Is your last name Kerry?

You were talking directly to me when the word "some" was used. Therefore I can make a fair conclusion as to what your intent was when using that word.

However, you were not in direct contact with the Telephia spokesperson when the word "some" was used. So you have no idea exactly how that person intended the word to be used.

You really need to get over yourself.

https://www.phonescoop.com/carriers/forum.php?fm=m&f ... »

When JD Powers said that Cingular ranked highes in customer satisfaction in the South, Cingular wasted no time in using it as a source:
http://cingular.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=press_rele ... »

So if you wondered why we put faith on JD Powers, there is your answer: Cingular itself has faith in it. Unless you think they became evil on the 1st quarter of 2006.

RUFF1415 said:

It's funny how T-Mobile has won Consumer Reports and JD Powers awards alongside Verizon for network quality, yet they have the highest churn of the nationals. Shows how much faith you can put into twisted consumer surveys like that... 🙄

First off, we have a pretty high rate of INVOLUNTARY churn, which has nothing to do with our service and everything to do with giving service to people with marginal credit.

Secondly, TMobile has a very high percentage, relative to the other carriers, of customers from overseas. They move home a lot and take their phones with them because we'll unlock them for use with a different SIM card. We don't hold them to contracts when they move back to E...
(continues)

Hey, I have nothing against T-Mobile as a company, but he went there.

If somebody is going to insist to me that churn relates directly back to network quality, then that's where it's going to go.

Take it up with the person I was responding to. 😉

It looks like you took my comment out of context.
Maybe I didn't make it clear that I was responding to RUFF.
The reason why I noted that Cingular praised JD Powers report, is that the member called RUFF implied that we shouldn't put much faith in Consumer Reports and JD Powers.
I was showing him that even the company that received a negative review in these reports, Cingular, placed faith on the JD Powers study.
So my point was not that Cingular brags about only the positive things, because I know all companies brag about the positive only. My point was that RUFF was contradicted by Cingular itself.

"The member called RUFF," ha, that has a ring to it.

Anyway, I was contradicted by Cingular itself? Not really. Just because they like to brag about it doesn't mean you can put faith in it. I still wouldn't put faith in Consumer Reports or JD if their results were more in tune with what I have experienced over my several years involved in the wireless industry.

Cingular does not have to put faith in JD Powers to boast one of their findings. It's good PR whether Cingular likes the study or not.

I have a question for you.

Cingular says they have the fewest dropped calls and you think they are bogus claims. Now you found that Cingular said they were tops in a certain region in the US and you think I should put more faith in J...
(continues)

You said:

Cingular says they have the fewest dropped calls and you think they are bogus claims. Now you found that Cingular said they were tops in a certain region in the US and you think I should put more faith in JD and CR. Why?

Show me when I put in doubt JD Powers' conclusion that Cingular was tops in ONE REGION. I never did.
You are trying to say that Cingular's great performance in ONE REGION somehow undermines my doubts about their NATIONWIDE claims and JD Powers and CR's credibility.

You are conveniently omitting the word "nationwide" when you refer to Cingular's claim that they have fewest dropped called "Nationwide".

The claim that has not been proven is the one that Telephia determined that they...
(continues)

kingsbridge77 said:
You are trying to say that Cingular's great performance in ONE REGION somehow undermines my doubts about their NATIONWIDE claims and JD Powers and CR's credibility.

First of all, your statements are contradictory.

Reread that statement, slowly. I never said anything that insinuated Cingular's great performance in one region undermines anything. I have no faith in JD Power's reports, so I haven't used Cingular's "great performance" as an argument for anything. That was you, bud. Why would I use JD Power's claims, to disprove JD Power's claims? 😳

Also, I wasn't conveniently omitting anything.

Yes, Cingular's claims to the fewest dropped calls is nationwide...because Tel...
(continues)

You are the one who are contradicting yourself.
Because if you believe we should not put faith on the JDP study, and Cingular put faith in it, then it means you believe Cingular has bad judgement.

In your opinion, Cingular puts faith in the wrong places.

But then you think that Cingular was sooo right in believing Telephia (even though Telephia never concluded that Cingular's fewest dropped calls nationwide were true), but it's wrong in believing JDP's study?
You should make up your mind.
The only way you would e happy is if Cingular issues a press release saying that the other half of the JDF report is crap.
...

I don't say "don't trust Telephia". I say "don't trust Cingular", until we learn that they are not misrepresenting T...
(continues)

You are the one who are contradicting yourself.
Because if you believe we should not put faith on the JDP study, and Cingular put faith in it, then it means you believe Cingular has bad judgement.

No I am not! I've already explained this before. Cingular doesn't have to have faith in whatever they put out in press releases. Just because there was a press release about it, doesn't mean the agree fully. It's a matter of good PR. Any company is going to brag about the "good stuff" whether they believe it's true or not.

In your opinion, Cingular puts faith in the wrong places.

Who are you to tell me my opinion? You are way off base.

But then you think that Cingular was so

...
(continues)

I have replies for all your counterpoints, but like you said it would be repetitive.
The lawsuit will clarify everything.
See u around.

Yes..I just read that...but only a few months ago their own site said 48 Million...

Makes me curious, was that a typo?

err...42...

They ended their contract with Radioshack at 48 Million...nice to see that they have grown.

Now if they sould like add a tower by the mall or in my backyard.