Why Verizon added 1.9 million
I think I am seeing a pattern of why Verizon is coming on so strong -- it is because of poor customer service on our (Cingular's) part. Prime example -- yesterday I had a call from a lady whose voicemail had not been working since two weeks ago.
I checked the notes on the acct and noticed that tech support just closed the case that was on file with a note "this is a known issue". I went through every troubleshooting step I could think of and everything that was in CSP. After failing to succeed, I then called tech support thinking they might be helpful. Boy was I WRONG. When I explained the customer's issue to the techie she was pretty rude and just said in a real testy way "*THIS* is a *KNOWN* issue and I'm filing an 'invalid call'...
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I checked the notes on the acct and noticed that tech support just closed the case that was on file with a note "this is a known issue". I went through every troubleshooting step I could think of and everything that was in CSP. After failing to succeed, I then called tech support thinking they might be helpful. Boy was I WRONG. When I explained the customer's issue to the techie she was pretty rude and just said in a real testy way "*THIS* is a *KNOWN* issue and I'm filing an 'invalid call'...
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😁 Ill Agree With That
thats probably half the battle right there the other is coverage area for people driving cross country. but the customer service is going to have to change quickly cause its been a while for them to have decent C.S.
thats probably half the battle right there the other is coverage area for people driving cross country. but the customer service is going to have to change quickly cause its been a while for them to have decent C.S.
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I seem to think the increase on what generally is a slow season is from people fleeing Cingular because of the merger. Now don't scream at me but certain markets had been hit with customers having the, 'what do I do now' attitude. Either put up with migration issues, wake up with service from Alltel or Suncom or whomever, and possibly the, 'hey if I switch I lose my free 1 billion bonus minute plan ATTWS gave me'.
When I owned a store back five, six, seven years ago, whatever, I sold Bellsouth Mobility and Nextel phones/service. When SBC/BS announced the formation of Cingular a ton of customers fled to ATTWS and Nextel because they thought the way Cingy was branding itself (and all out advertising blitzes) matched more of a child's pre...
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When I owned a store back five, six, seven years ago, whatever, I sold Bellsouth Mobility and Nextel phones/service. When SBC/BS announced the formation of Cingular a ton of customers fled to ATTWS and Nextel because they thought the way Cingy was branding itself (and all out advertising blitzes) matched more of a child's pre...
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oh great, I didn't read the dates
some moron bumped up this thread before I posted 👿
some moron bumped up this thread before I posted 👿
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oh.....I thought you did. I was saying you're the moron. Let's find out who did and kick his ass.
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IN store customer service is terrible as well. Unless the sales rep is going to make a buck off a customer he does not feel it's his job to properly represent Cingular as an employee and actually help a present customer.
I have read here that many sales reps will not even talk to a customer who he cannot upsell and insted refers them to CSRs via 611, This is terrible CS and Sales reps need to know they are CSRS as well and the public face of Cingular.
Verizon did well by default. Cingualr dropped the ball on the ATT customers, raised family talk and generally has unhappy employees. THATS why VErizon did so well.
I have read here that many sales reps will not even talk to a customer who he cannot upsell and insted refers them to CSRs via 611, This is terrible CS and Sales reps need to know they are CSRS as well and the public face of Cingular.
Verizon did well by default. Cingualr dropped the ball on the ATT customers, raised family talk and generally has unhappy employees. THATS why VErizon did so well.
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kingfrog77 said:
Verizon did well by default. Cingualr dropped the ball on the ATT customers, raised family talk and generally has unhappy employees. THATS why VErizon did so well.
That could explain a little of the adds situation. But churn? Verizon has record-low churn (1.2%!) because cingular mistreated ATT customers, raised family plan pricing, and treats their reps badly?
Don't think so, Nostradamus. VZW retains folks so well based on what VZW offers, not what cingular doesnt. After all, if VZW didnt treat 'em well and offer good service, theres other carriers people could go to besides cingular. 😉
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NO there really are not any other viable carriers with the reach of Cingular and Verizon. T Mobile? Nextel (really now) Sprint? NO there are no real choices for national coverage except Cingy and Verizon.
To leave Verizon now would be nuts for those who would rather not want to involve themselves with network merging issues, Customer Service issues and disgruntled employees.
No..........VErizon's lower churn and recent add numbers is indded a direct result of Cingulars missteps. No doubt about it. Doesnt take a genius to see that. You should send them a fruit basket and a thank you card.
To leave Verizon now would be nuts for those who would rather not want to involve themselves with network merging issues, Customer Service issues and disgruntled employees.
No..........VErizon's lower churn and recent add numbers is indded a direct result of Cingulars missteps. No doubt about it. Doesnt take a genius to see that. You should send them a fruit basket and a thank you card.
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Any network merging issues have, for the most part, affected former AT&T customers. I've been with Cingular ever since the merge and I haven't experienced any problems. Customer service? I don't care if it's bad, as long as I never have to use it (and I haven't). Finally, any time I have stepped foot into a Cingular store I have been addressed with friendly and helpful attitudes, comission involved or not. I'd leave Verizon right now (if I still had a contract with them) and come to Cingular without any regrets. And I for one am not nuts, thank you.
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I walked into a Cingular store over the weekend, and they had ZERO inventory on smart phones and PDA phones.
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Really though what can Cingular do to keep the cust from going to Verizon, Nextel, tmobile ect espically the former Attws cust they had it wayy to good cust i had yesterday was on a 39.99 plan National coverage with 1200 anytime mins(800add) poor guy broke his phone we have blue phones for them but cant give them under this type of thing how can yah convince a cust like this to go to a NEW 39.99 plan with 450mins WOW u get rollover but if yah dont use all ur mins and u get enough rollover u are blatently on the wrong plan Cingular is set to loose Millions more if they cant get there act together if they have to punish the cust with Integration then at least throw them a Bone and give they better plans then the other guys casue if not they ar...
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Bah. Not everyones concerned with having the last iota of coverage. T-Mobile seems to do well quarter after quarter without having an ubernetwork. And the average customer who doesnt follow wireless doesnt even know about cingulars network merging issues. All they know is what they see on the TV commercials: '50 million M2M calling family'. 'Allover network'. 'Rollover'. 'More bars in more places'. Yes, cingulars CS does indeed suck, and that does affect even uninformed customers, but that doesnt take away from the fact that verizons CS is, in fact, pretty good.
Face it KF (or dont- I think your capacity for self-delusion is as impressive as nextel18's at times), its not just cingular doing bad- its also verizon doing good. Great network...
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Face it KF (or dont- I think your capacity for self-delusion is as impressive as nextel18's at times), its not just cingular doing bad- its also verizon doing good. Great network...
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Also (and I just gotta add this)- people on the Verizon forum warned you MONTHS ago on how there were going to be issues with the merger. You pooh-poohed them and chose instead to engage in a bout of Big Orange chest-thumping. NOW you use cingulars intergration issues as an excuse for why Verizon is doing so well?!?
OH man KF- you missed your calling. You obviously shouldve been a politician. You wacky guy you. 🤣
OH man KF- you missed your calling. You obviously shouldve been a politician. You wacky guy you. 🤣
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VZWVan said:
Also (and I just gotta add this)- people on the Verizon forum warned you MONTHS ago on how there were going to be issues with the merger. You pooh-poohed them and chose instead to engage in a bout of Big Orange chest-thumping. NOW you use cingulars intergration issues as an excuse for why Verizon is doing so well?!?
OH man KF- you missed your calling. You obviously shouldve been a politician. You wacky guy you. 🤣
intergration issues are expected with any mergers of this size. i'm not defending Cingular but i'm sure when verizon intergrated all it's companys to become one it had issues also. but they have been around long enough to work all those issues out. give cingular time and thi...
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hellfire666 said:...VZWVan said:
Also (and I just gotta add this)- people on the Verizon forum warned you MONTHS ago on how there were going to be issues with the merger. You pooh-poohed them and chose instead to engage in a bout of Big Orange chest-thumping. NOW you use cingulars intergration issues as an excuse for why Verizon is doing so well?!?
OH man KF- you missed your calling. You obviously shouldve been a politician. You wacky guy you. 🤣
intergration issues are expected with any mergers of this size. i'm not defending Cingular but i'm sure when verizon intergrated all it's companys to become one it had issues also. but they have been around long enough to work all those
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You have too small of a sample size here to make any generalizations like that about sales reps or customer care.
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texaswireless said:
You have too small of a sample size here to make any generalizations like that about sales reps or customer care.
FAir enough. What is the real reason Cingular got trounced by VErizon Who does not even hold the precious JD Powers ratings anymore and has crappy phones, as well as crippled BT and a lousy digital network.
Dumb Luck?
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KF...
people, more often than not, judge a phone by it's call quality, not by it's size...last time I checked, the purpose of a phone was to make a call, not look as though somebody was having playtime with a new toy.
As for lousy digital network, what's your reasoning? Because VZ uses CDMA instead of GSM? Because the broadcast radius spans 12 ft. instead of 8 of GSM? Because CDMA can hold over 800 more users per tower than GSM? Because there are fewer dropped calls because GSM doesn't have a "soft hand off" process like CDMA? Get real! GSM USA is a buzz-word that really holds no water for US useage....
people, more often than not, judge a phone by it's call quality, not by it's size...last time I checked, the purpose of a phone was to make a call, not look as though somebody was having playtime with a new toy.
As for lousy digital network, what's your reasoning? Because VZ uses CDMA instead of GSM? Because the broadcast radius spans 12 ft. instead of 8 of GSM? Because CDMA can hold over 800 more users per tower than GSM? Because there are fewer dropped calls because GSM doesn't have a "soft hand off" process like CDMA? Get real! GSM USA is a buzz-word that really holds no water for US useage....
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I hate debates like this. No matter who you talk to someone is going to have their reasoning for which carrier is better. The fact of the matter is is that it depends on where you live. One area may have superior Cingular coverage where Verizon sucks and vice versa. I have perfect Cingular coverage in my area where Verizon has no coverage at all.
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cagrey said:
Because CDMA can hold over 800 more users per tower than GSM? Because there are fewer dropped calls because GSM doesn't have a "soft hand off" process like CDMA?
Wow. You may not know this, but there isn't a cell tower in the world that can handle 800 callers. It doesn't matter what technology it is.
I am also beginning to doubt the "more dropped calls" line about GSM. I never once dropped a call on my gsm phone in Korea, and I owned that one for 3 years. I recently bought a Sony gsm phone and have yet to drop a call.
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CamelTowing said:cagrey said:
Because CDMA can hold over 800 more users per tower than GSM? Because there are fewer dropped calls because GSM doesn't have a "soft hand off" process like CDMA?
Wow. You may not know this, but there isn't a cell tower in the world that can handle 800 callers. It doesn't matter what technology it is.
I am also beginning to doubt the "more dropped calls" line about GSM. I never once dropped a call on my gsm phone in Korea, and I owned that one for 3 years. I recently bought a Sony gsm phone and have yet to drop a call.
Wow... thats funny considering S. Korea is almost entirely CDMA.
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adilus said:CamelTowing said:cagrey said:
Because CDMA can hold over 800 more users per tower than GSM? Because there are fewer dropped calls because GSM doesn't have a "soft hand off" process like CDMA?
Wow. You may not know this, but there isn't a cell tower in the world that can handle 800 callers. It doesn't matter what technology it is.
I am also beginning to doubt the "more dropped calls" line about GSM. I never once dropped a call on my gsm phone in Korea, and I owned that one for 3 years. I recently bought a Sony gsm phone and have yet to drop a call.
Wow... thats funny considering S. Korea is almost entirely CDMA.
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What it comes down too is Verizon pays their front line people very well. they have great benefits as well. they also pay their CS reps very well on the back end. They do have the most RELIABLE network noone can challenge that.
So the score card:
1. RELIABLE NETWORK
2. WELL PAID EMPLOYEES = EMPLOYEES WHO LIKE THEIR JOBS AND THEREFORE WANT TO HELP PEOPLE.
Cingular on the other hand pays their employees sub-par. benefits are pretty good but on average, at least on the sales side, our reps make about $20,000 less per year. On our side for the network, you know the LARGEST VOICE AND DATA NETWORK in AMERICA, is a good network but i currently use cell phones on both sides and my verizon phone always works better than cingular.
Lets see th...
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So the score card:
1. RELIABLE NETWORK
2. WELL PAID EMPLOYEES = EMPLOYEES WHO LIKE THEIR JOBS AND THEREFORE WANT TO HELP PEOPLE.
Cingular on the other hand pays their employees sub-par. benefits are pretty good but on average, at least on the sales side, our reps make about $20,000 less per year. On our side for the network, you know the LARGEST VOICE AND DATA NETWORK in AMERICA, is a good network but i currently use cell phones on both sides and my verizon phone always works better than cingular.
Lets see th...
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I would've thought that scorecard would improve Cingy's bottom line? Pay the employees crap, they're still there, that is that much less in payroll expenditures. You can always weed out the ones that feel they are treated unfair and underpaid and replace them with someone who will (for the first 90 days until they see whats going on) do the job with a smile...
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Yes 100% turnover every 3 months would be the way to run the Biz....or start recruiting from MCdonalds...they would love the pay increase...they dont know any better. the more ignorant the employee they hire the better!
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cingsales9090 said:
Cingular on the other hand pays their employees sub-par. benefits are pretty good but on average, at least on the sales side, our reps make about $20,000 less per year. On our side for the network, you know the LARGEST VOICE AND DATA NETWORK in AMERICA, is a good network but i currently use cell phones on both sides and my verizon phone always works better than cingular.
Lets see the score for Cingular:
1. Larger(but not more reliable network) network
-1. Poorley paid employees all around= employees who dont get up every morning and say god i love goin to work.
Q: How bad does cingular really treat its employees?
I have a few acquaintances who are cingualr reps, and they sometimes ...
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Yes it is! P&P sometimes are useless because policy changes without notice sometimes and before you know it you have mislead the customer not even having the intention of doing so. When the customer realizes it they call in to a rep that has to deal with it (keep in mind they are not paid good enough to care), which includes educating the cus about the issue then having to fix it. With enormous pressure to on call times and other quality standards the rep sometimes says f**k it. They paint a rosey picture for the customer, fix half the issues, and then try to hang up as quick as possible. With the next billing statement the customer sees that the issues is not fully resolved, and you know what pretty much happens.
This example may seem f...
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This example may seem f...
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judog2g said:...
Yes it is! P&P sometimes are useless because policy changes without notice sometimes and before you know it you have mislead the customer not even having the intention of doing so. When the customer realizes it they call in to a rep that has to deal with it (keep in mind they are not paid good enough to care), which includes educating the cus about the issue then having to fix it. With enormous pressure to on call times and other quality standards the rep sometimes says f**k it. They paint a rosey picture for the customer, fix half the issues, and then try to hang up as quick as possible. With the next billing statement the customer sees that the issues is not fully resolved, and you know what pretty much ha
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it's not really that bad. i love my job. i have it very easy. now some of the policys do suck but that comes with every company and job.
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it's incredibly ignorant to believe that cingular had more to do with verizon suceeding than verizon did.
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The general shock by the community at VEriaon's results prove it's Cingulars issues which caused Verizons recent surge.
Ignorance is believing Verizon was soley responsiblle for their success. without Cingular's "help."
Cingular has the market to lose. Better digital coverage. Huge M2M base, Service in top 100 markets, Better phones , more flexiility with GSM technology, yet they cannot manage to maintain leadership over a CDMA carrier who squeezes every penny from their customers and despite claims has poor service in many more densly populated areas.
Who leans hard on their analog service to lay claim to most coverage area. Whos digital network barely eclipses T Mobile.
No Its Cingular Verizon Should thank.
Ignorance is believing Verizon was soley responsiblle for their success. without Cingular's "help."
Cingular has the market to lose. Better digital coverage. Huge M2M base, Service in top 100 markets, Better phones , more flexiility with GSM technology, yet they cannot manage to maintain leadership over a CDMA carrier who squeezes every penny from their customers and despite claims has poor service in many more densly populated areas.
Who leans hard on their analog service to lay claim to most coverage area. Whos digital network barely eclipses T Mobile.
No Its Cingular Verizon Should thank.
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Wow... you are very delusional. And at this rate, its gonna take Verizon about 2 or 3 quarters to over take Cingy for the total amount of customers?
And a digital network that barely ecplipses T-Mo... hahahhahhha.. there u go again talking out ur butt. You can go on VZW's site and see the digital only map... if what u said was even remotely true every single phone VZW phone would be tri mode. Whats it like being so stupid?
And a digital network that barely ecplipses T-Mo... hahahhahhha.. there u go again talking out ur butt. You can go on VZW's site and see the digital only map... if what u said was even remotely true every single phone VZW phone would be tri mode. Whats it like being so stupid?
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unfortunatly Verizon just might overtake Cingular. Cingular has dropped the ball and is squandering a great opportunity. Verizons digital extended services network IS A JOKE. I don't care what VErizon prints on their maps. Its a total joke. Their major phones are drug store brands. They get the Razor long after its old news and they are rejoicing!!! Amazing.
Cingular should be spanking Verizon but Cingular cannot get their collective heads out of their azzes. Thus Verizon does well by default. Seems Cingular execs might be holding shares of VZ.
Cingular should be spanking Verizon but Cingular cannot get their collective heads out of their azzes. Thus Verizon does well by default. Seems Cingular execs might be holding shares of VZ.
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Before anyone takes anything KF says seriously, please remember that this is the wonderdummy who trolled the Verizon forum for months, hollerin that cingular was going to just OWN. LOL.
KF specializes in trolling and being wrong, but trying to sound authoritative while doing so. He'd probably make a good used car salesman. 😉
KF specializes in trolling and being wrong, but trying to sound authoritative while doing so. He'd probably make a good used car salesman. 😉
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kingfrog77 said:
unfortunatly Verizon just might overtake Cingular. Cingular has dropped the ball and is squandering a great opportunity. Verizons digital extended services network IS A JOKE. I don't care what VErizon prints on their maps. Its a total joke. Their major phones are drug store brands. They get the Razor long after its old news and they are rejoicing!!! Amazing.
Cingular should be spanking Verizon but Cingular cannot get their collective heads out of their azzes. Thus Verizon does well by default. Seems Cingular execs might be holding shares of VZ.
There is no doubt in my mind that VZW will overtake Cingy. You can't have half-a$$ed service, a half-a$$ed network and expect to be the to...
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i said it was very ignorant of you to think that verizon's success had more to do with cingular than it did with verizon. nowhere in there did i say that cingular didn't "help" things.
verizon's not winning because cingular's letting them. verizon's winning because it's proving it's the best option for most of america. cingular's woes just makes the gap a little wider.
verizon's not winning because cingular's letting them. verizon's winning because it's proving it's the best option for most of america. cingular's woes just makes the gap a little wider.
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I recently stopped working for Cingular and can say that they have their work cut out for them - at least in the market I was in!
Cingular seems to be run by a bunch of people with no real direction except "we are number one! we must beat verizon!" But nobody seems to have a real battle plan. You can preach the 4 R's, ROLLOVER and a common customer experience down everyone's throats, but without a real plan of action I imagine each quarter will continue to slide a little more.
In my market, the network is horrible. Dropped calls are a daily occurance for Cingular customers (not reliable) while over at Verizon Wireless dropped calls are a rarity (reliable). The investments in network are coming but way too late! Verizon knows that ...
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Cingular seems to be run by a bunch of people with no real direction except "we are number one! we must beat verizon!" But nobody seems to have a real battle plan. You can preach the 4 R's, ROLLOVER and a common customer experience down everyone's throats, but without a real plan of action I imagine each quarter will continue to slide a little more.
In my market, the network is horrible. Dropped calls are a daily occurance for Cingular customers (not reliable) while over at Verizon Wireless dropped calls are a rarity (reliable). The investments in network are coming but way too late! Verizon knows that ...
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What market are you? I have friends with Cingular in Phoenix and LA. Talking to them on their cell phones is like talking to someone on a HAM radio. And if we talk to long... it'll drop. I drove cross country bout 4 months ago with my all digital VZW phone (LG 4500) and I got a singal 99% of the way... (81 S to 40 W straight thru to Flagstaff)... heck I had 2 bars of signal in El Maipais in NM... 40 miles in the middle of the desert. And when we got to Phoenix service was fine... not quite as good as Philly but infinitely better than Cingy. I think alot of that has to do with the fact that as a customer I can dial *225 (I think) and update the roaming profile in my VZW phone to find the local towers and with Cingy u can't.
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adilus said:
... I think alot of that has to do with the fact that as a customer I can dial *225 (I think) and update the roaming profile in my VZW phone to find the local towers and with Cingy u can't.
Correction: it is *228 option 2 (not *225) 😉
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