Ash... that IS an extrapolation of F&F... it was not prepared by me. Those figures were prepared based on your own marketing tools for Fair and Flexible by Current Analysis.

Ah, but price point comparision is not fair in this regard. case in point:

i, for instance, would benefit from fair and flexible. i go to college, i travel arount alot, so i have a nationwide plan, blah blah blah(btw, never had connection issues anywhere in the u.s. i've traveled to using sprint, cept where there were roads and no people, then i roamed(several years and it happened once)). i use my phone some months 300 minutes, some months 1000. with cingular, i could get get roll over, wich is cool(i almost switched for it once upon a time), but i still would pay for a set number of minutes, and maybe i'd use them, maybe not. and i still could go over. so say i use the 600 minute plan for $50. i use 300 min the first month, i hav...
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The fact of the matter is that you are one of the rare people this plan would benefit in the early stages of the plan. But if you look at the actual costs involved long term, Rollover still comes out on top.

Another benefit of Cingular over Sprint is that you don't have to pay extra to roam off net. Sprint charges extra for access to roaming partners.

So to equal Cingular's plan, you are actually spending a minimum of $40 for 300 minutes.

Not to mention, as much as Sprint wants you to believe they are all digital, all of their coverage is not. This creates problems with things OTHER than calling, and even creates quality of call issues on calling. Analog is far less efficient, and has much worse call clarity than CDMA.

With Cingu...
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I agree with you on the point that with the Cingular Nationwide GAIT plan having roaming included is a good deal compared to Sprint asking for $5. The only point I would say against that is, that not everyone needs nationwide roaming, that's why it is an option. I have been with Sprint since 1999 and I have never run into issues with roaming, because all of my traveling has been on Sprints network. When it comes to people that need to Roam and like the idea of not having to worry about time spent roaming, Cingular does have an advantage.

Actually I was speaking of GSM Nation, not our GAIT plans.

Nah, it's 35 dollars. you can roam with out the $5 charge, but just end up paying per minute. for me and most sprint users i personally know, there is little to no time spent in roam only areas, so i never use the free roam package. don't even think i've had to use $5 worth of roam in the years i've been using sprint. sell me the idea that the long term effects of having a drasticly different monthly usage, or at least try. i work in computing, so i need to see numbers, no offence. i've done the numbers for my own minutes, and sprint comes out on top so far, tho i admit i don't know a whole lot about cingular. some info, i call home phones more than mobile phones, i come from a mindset that a cell phone is secondary to a land line, so...
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phonepimp3376 said:
The fact of the matter is that you are one of the rare people this plan would benefit in the early stages of the plan. But if you look at the actual costs involved long term, Rollover still comes out on top.

Another benefit of Cingular over Sprint is that you don't have to pay extra to roam off net. Sprint charges extra for access to roaming partners.

So to equal Cingular's plan, you are actually spending a minimum of $40 for 300 minutes.

Not to mention, as much as Sprint wants you to believe they are all digital, all of their coverage is not. This creates problems with things OTHER than calling, and even creates quality of call issues on calling. Analog is far less efficient, and has much wor

...
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Actually, wrong on both points. GSM nation roams onto ATTWS and T-Mobile for national carriers, and quite a few regional and rural carriers as well.

As for coverage, GSM Nation is ALL DIGITAL coverage. Go to http://www.sprint.com select the national coverage map. The dark green and beige are digital coverage. The lighter green is ANALOG, or non-digital coverage. Then compare GSM Nation, which is ALL digital. I think you'll see my point.

The downfall of analog is that it does not support advanced features like internet and downloads, and will not allow access to digital voicemail. Call quality is abyssmal compared to digital.

I thought GSM was analog?

Just kidding, wanted to see what you would say.

😁

I was about to ask what kind of paint you've been sniffing...lol

phonepimp you are dead wrong. "As for coverage, GSM Nation is ALL DIGITAL coverage. Go to http://www.sprint.com select the national coverage map. The dark green and beige are digital coverage. The lighter green is ANALOG, or non-digital coverage. Then compare GSM Nation, which is ALL digital. I think you'll see my point."

that is completely wrong! now the dark green is sprint corporately owned license. the bage is affiliate market. the light green that is other carriers network. the light green is both digital and analog coverage!!!!! i repeat the light green on the coverage map is both digital and analog coverage!!!!!!

hear is what you fail to comprehend sprint does not inflate it's native coverage by showing other carriers network a...
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Dude, give it up... If I misunderstand it then so do your customers...the lighter green is labeled 'off-network roaming - analog' How the HELL is that digital?

phonepimp3376 said:
Dude, give it up... If I misunderstand it then so do your customers...the lighter green is labeled 'off-network roaming - analog' How the HELL is that digital?

PP, You have said over and over again that most of Sprint's network is Analog. You have just proved yourself wrong. If most of it is analog, then why oh why do the coverage maps show Off Network for the areas you are referring to? Common sense would indicate that off network means just what it sounds like, Not part of the Sprint Network, but your phone can work there in roaming....

I have said that most of their COVERAGE is analog... get it straight

Coverage is wherever you claim a Sprint phone will work, not just NATIVE network coverage.

Why does Joe customer care? If he can use his phone and doesn't pay for it then he is very happy.
You think that Sprint only uses the analog parts of the roaming partners' networks? Think again. Sprint customers have access to ALL CDMA coverage. This includes all of Verizon's, Alltel's, USCC's and any other CDMA carrier.
As a Sprint customer myself I am in the Sprint network about 99% of the time. I have Sprint coverage where ther is no ATTWS coverage. When I step out of the footprint I am on the Verizon network CDMA. In these areas there is no GSM coverage by anyone.

Then why do I constantly get complaints of not being able to use the features they PAY for because analog doesn't support them, huh pal?

This message is directed towards PhonePimp and his constant complaints about Sprint and its pricing policies. If you sign a 2 year contract with Sprint, PCS to PCS is no longer a $5 option, it is included free of charge. This is closer to the Cingular/Verizon policy. Just so you know its there, I think it is a fairly new option.

Actually, that's supposed to only be with multiline plans. We occasionally abuse it to give free pcs-to-pcs to customers who only have one line, which is why Sprint took the option away earlier in the year. It was brought back by customer request.

My fault, thanks for the correction. I thought it was just an option if you signed a 2 year contract.

By keeping the rollover for down the line, that is a nice perk.

The main thing you need to realize is that for people that want Sprint service (for whatever reason it may be). That also have very drastic shifts in usage Fair & Flexible is a good deal for them compared to our fixed rate plans. Because if they only go over their 300 minutes (say they spike at a 1,000 in a month) once or twice a year, then by saving money all the other months, this works out well for them. Again, this plan is not for everybody.

That's the point I have been trying to make... it is a niche plan.

Unfortunately, the way most reps sell it here in the NorthEast, you would think it was the Holy Grail. Hope that's not the case nationwide.

Despite how some may try and sell in on the North East, that type of selling is not typical everywhere you go.

That's good... because as I think we both agree, there is a very specific customer F&F really benefits... most are better off on fixed plans.

agreed

i think fairf and flexable WILL revolutionize the industry, the key word is WILL. currently it is not the best set up i think after sprint fine tunes it a bit it will be a far better idea.

as for me personally i sell the majority of my customer 2000 min - 6000 min plans. average mrc 98$$$

Actually not,
We offer it for the first time user who is definitely not going to be a power user. Most of our activations to Sprint are actually ATTWS and T-Mo ports coming in for coverage and techno reasons so we can predict their usage. The holy grail? No. A superior tool for those who are extremely inconsistent in their usage? Yes.
F&F must be considered on an annual basis in order to be understood properly. This takes a serious adjustment in the thinking of wireless reps because monthly price plans are so ingrained into the psyche. People who think they want rollover minutes are who we offer F&F to because for most who are attracted to the concept of rollover it is really out of fear of having a huge bill during the month or two tha...
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Okay, lets compare the two on a contract basis.

Assuming 2 years at entry level price points:

F&F= 300 minutes - 35.00
off net roaming - 5.00

additional minutes to match the opposing price plan - 150 @ .10 = 15.00

Total/month = 55.00


GSM Nation = 450 minutes with rollover - 39.99
no additional for off net roaming

Total/month = 39.99


Difference 15.01/month

Total difference over 2 years = 360.24

and your point is...?

but you are basing that as if they use 450 minutes per month...what if they don't use that many?

They keep stating that F&F is better than rollover, so I used the bottom of the rollover plans. If they use less than 450, those minutes accumulate to be used in the event of overage.

Not to mention, Sprint charges extra for off net roaming, bringing the pricing in line with the 39.99 price point at Cingular, who does not charge extra for off net roaming.

Actually, add an additional 120.00 to get the unlimited nationwide M2M that Cingular gives you free at the 39.99 price... so total monthly cost for F&F = 35.00/300 minutes, plus 5.00 for off-network roaming and 5.00 for mobile to mobile. Monthly total... 45.00/to match features, but not total minutes. To match minutes as well, add 15.00/month. 35+5+5+15 = 60/month

So your two year cost for F&F to match GSM Nation - 1440.00
Subtract the cost of Cingular GSM Nation for 24 months - 959.76

Leaves you paying Sprint an additional - 480.24

FOR BASICALLY THE SAME PLAN!

Now compare Sprint's National Coverage map from their website to Cingular's GSM NAtion, and notice that Sprint's digital coverage is substantially LESS than Cingular's!

PP, I understand what your talking about I've seen their map too but bud...you gotta settle, do let Sprint get to you that much, oyu'll give yourself a stroke

Nah... I just think its funny that they can't see all that ANALOG... must be the rose colored glasses.

seriously I've been following this thread for a while; dont beat a dead horse 😕 . anits not that serious. I've had sprint previously for more or less the data the coverage didnt bother me, and for $15.00 unlim data on either treo they had available is a good deal. cingular's data is more than double that. the point i'm trying to make here is every carrier has its strengths/ weaknesses, each one has some thing a certain customer is looking for. RIGHT NOW I'M WITH NEXTEL OOps... sorry for the caps; and I get unlim incoming that is so much better than fighting over how many minutes you have left or be getting. Stop wasting your time over things that change from quarter to quarter. 😉

PS I still want my data, just cant wait until the ...
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You must not be familiar with MEdia Works on Cingular... 1500 text messages, 200 MMS messages and unlimited Wireless Internet Express for 19.99

phonepimp3376 said:
You must not be familiar with MEdia Works on Cingular... 1500 text messages, 200 MMS messages and unlimited Wireless Internet Express for 19.99

With Sprint my data with a Palm was still only $15.00, If need to contact some one I'll call or email that simple. 😉

I have a buisness that I'm going to base out of Mexico and I need to keep in touch with my associates. International DirectConnect is a hell of alot cheaper than renting a phone down there or roaming with anybody from here; plus certain packages include Intn'l data associated w/ the walkie talkie. The i930 will be dual band iden/gsm smartphone. Cingular does not meet my requirements. And again you just can't seem to let ...
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we have an unlimited text option for $10 a month.... on a family plan it's $10 primary, $5 secondary even. Your MEdia Works things are gay, too. I went on your website to read about it and it sounds MEdiocre at best. Maybe that's why you're charging $20 for unlimited internet... you can probably visit like 3 sites, your phones aren't very fast with data and to charge more for data functionability would be ludicrous since you have the customer doing this whole EDGE vs. GPRS?? EDGE isn't in my state?! wait, what? Oh... Sprint just has one thing... Vision? Cool... Oh, and Sprint has PTT too? TIGHT? I can get a Vision and ReadyLink package? Now THOSE are FEATURES. I don't think I know anyone who would rather have ATTWS's towers on a GSM network ...
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sorry if I seem confused, but when I see ANALOG that does NOT ****ING MEAN DIGITAL!!!

phonepimp3376 said:
sorry if I seem confused, but when I see ANALOG that does NOT ****ING MEAN DIGITAL!!!

PP
it's analog coverage NET, that means it's used as a last option when digital is not available. digital is still present. i think you have a learning disability. i can't help you, you're stubborn and refuse to let new information enter your brain. 🙄

...that said, who's going to volunteer to explain that the world is round, not flat, to PP?? he still doesn't get it.... 😈

Yes, I know its last resort... but a significant part of the network IS analog...that's what you refuse to see looking at that map. The lighter green is NOT digital in any way shape or form, is it?

Off net analog roaming means that there IS no digital coverage in that part of the net, right? Or does Sprint speak some language that makes analog means something other than NON-DIGITAL?

it means that WHEN you are off the network, in certain spots in the light green, it will go to analog. jesus christ you are so difficult to educate...

In ALL spots in the light green ash... just say it. If there were digital coverage there it wouldn't be labeled ANALOG, would it? And looking at the map, there is a great deal of coverage when you ARE off the network. Agreed?

I have never said Sprint's NATIVE coverage is analog. But your coverage maps does not show JUST native coverage. Of the coverage it depicts, the majority is OFF net, and analog. This has been my point from the beginning. So why do I need to be educated?

By comparison, when you look at a Cingular GSM map, all you see is digital, because there ARE no analog areas.

phonepimp3376 said:
In ALL spots in the light green ash... just say it. If there were digital coverage there it wouldn't be labeled ANALOG, would it? And looking at the map, there is a great deal of coverage when you ARE off the network. Agreed?

I have never said Sprint's NATIVE coverage is analog. But your coverage maps does not show JUST native coverage. Of the coverage it depicts, the majority is OFF net, and analog. This has been my point from the beginning. So why do I need to be educated?

By comparison, when you look at a Cingular GSM map, all you see is digital, because there ARE no analog areas.

YOU FUC*ING IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!! JESUS! OKAY READY ONE MORE TIME DILDO!!
Verizon. They use CDMA. We ...
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🤭 incapacitated. 😁

Then why not show it as off network digital with the rest of that pictured, ash? You DO indicate off network digital on the map. And you show off network ANALOG. So why use something as confusing as 'its labeled analog, but its digital'.

Do you honestly think a customer looking at that thinks analog=digital? please!

i didn't make the damn map i was just taught how to interpret it... write to marketting if you have that much beef, but STOP saying crap that isn't accurate. THANKS.

Its at least as accurate as the map... and more easily supported, as what I see is what everyone else sees, and probably THINKS as well.

If it were me, I would be making sure the marketing materials were easy for the customer to understand.

actually that's true because i thought what you did before too... ha 🤭 😁

See, I'm not as stupid as I look...lol

Check out this link for roaming options:

http://www1.sprintpcs.com/explore/coverage/RoamingCv ... »

It shows the digital roaming areas. Sprint prefers to roam on CDMA because it is cheaper than roaming on analog.
Phonepimp, I hope this answers your question about digital roaming with Sprint.

Then why don't your marketing materials reflect this coverage? I know about the digital coverage on and off net. My main point is that your materials make this far from clear.

How unclear is their own website in the roaming section?
You do not backpedal well at all my friend.
If I was looking on the Sprint website to find out about roaming options I think I would click the roaming tab. They do have one map that calls roaming analog, they just haven't changed the terminology yet. And it is a general map.
Big whoop! It just goes to show a "let's see if we can find a weakness in our competitors or if we can create one if we can't find a real one." attitude that is so prevalent in wireless.
Let's talk about reality. A Sprint customer can use any CDMA or analog signal without roaming charges anywhere in the USA. A GSM customer can use GSM so in some cases no roaming means no talking because GSM is not nearly as wel...
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Not nearly as well built out my eye! You do realize that even on your latest 'roaming map' you provided, we have more digital coverage?

Analog has them all beat, but analog is a very poor substitute for digital.

For some of your coverage you depend on ATTWS, correct?
They greatly overestimate their coverage. Just like they advertised that they have more towers than anyone else. And that GSM is the newest technology and will replace CDMA and on and on. They have absolutely no credibility. In fact they were sued over coverage maps several years ago and were forced to let thousands of customers out of their contracts.
They let the customers out of their contracts and didn't change the maps nor did they add coverage to those locations.
If a customer needs analog to make a call and can make the call over having no digital signal at all they could care less. The fact is they made the call.
Also Cingular is having a wee problem in California. It seem...
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Sprint gives their customers free mobile to mobile on plans that have two year contracts.

we charge extra for free and clear america ($5 for up to one half total talktime in roaming mode)because the majority of our clients DON'T ROAM and we ARE ETHICAL and allow them the option to not have to pay for something they probably won't use. Look at it this way, too... we have confidence that our own network is sufficient... but recognize that if a client is needing an analog signal as a cushion to fallback on to use their phone in random patches while driving in the boonies or something (whatever the case may be)... get the $5 free and clear america attachment. look: bottom line is, you tried to make fair and flexible look bad by turning it into rollover... well, an equilalent to rollover, when you added that ridiculous $15 by doing .1...
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Just thought I'd comment... just because not all of your customers don't need roaming, doesn't mean they won't need it or use it as a backup. Some of our clients are truck drivers and the roaming is an excellent option for them. I am glad there are choices and the customers that need it, don't mind paying an extra five bucks a month 🙂

I used to sell Cingular and i think rollover is a great marketing tool but in my opinion, if you don't normally use all your minutes, rollover doesn't really matter. But people really like to hear "rollover minutes" and it was a good way to overcome not having unlimited night and weekend minutes.

no unlimited night and weekend minutes?! oh wow, i am so niave... i just assumed every carrier did that... that certainly changes things. on a sprint fair and flex plan with nights beginning at 7pm, a client can get WAY more talk time in a collective year than a rollover customer....

Do your homework, ash...we DO

Have you looked lately, gannonchic... we do. unlimited M2M as well.