More Upgrade Policy Stupidity
Probably been brought up before, but let's assume we have a customer who doesn't meet the requirements, and they're on a $69.99 plan with 3 $9.99 add-a-line's.
Let's say the customer wants to upgrade into a treo, and increase their rate plan, and add the unlimited data to their account?
Would they allow a discount even if the system showed them as being unable to achieve such a thing?
I remember this is the way exception upgrades used to go, they'd only approve them if the customer initially increased their plan or added features.
Let's say the customer wants to upgrade into a treo, and increase their rate plan, and add the unlimited data to their account?
Would they allow a discount even if the system showed them as being unable to achieve such a thing?
I remember this is the way exception upgrades used to go, they'd only approve them if the customer initially increased their plan or added features.
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That isn't quite true. There are a few small exceptions. If it is due to revenue then they could increase their plan. The vast majority are NOT excluded on revenue though but rather habit items like usage that cannot be changed by a simple plan upgrade.
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We were told that in training. We were told more than three times that: "There's absolutely no exceptions to this policy." None whatsoever. âšī¸
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Well,
There are no exceptions except in the case of revenue since that is easily fixed. On the rebenue side Cingular is also targeting these customers with specific upgrade offers IF they move to a $39.99 minimum. If they choose to move to said plan there is NO WAY they could go back to the old one so problem is solved.
Everything else I agree. Exceptions cannot be made because the reason is usage patterns and habit. We cannot make an exception there because we would be asking them to change the way they use their phone and that is not practical for customers. There is no way to hold them to their word if they promise to not use as much, etc. (had a customer ask me if they promised to use less MTM, 10K worth, would we subsidize a ...
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There are no exceptions except in the case of revenue since that is easily fixed. On the rebenue side Cingular is also targeting these customers with specific upgrade offers IF they move to a $39.99 minimum. If they choose to move to said plan there is NO WAY they could go back to the old one so problem is solved.
Everything else I agree. Exceptions cannot be made because the reason is usage patterns and habit. We cannot make an exception there because we would be asking them to change the way they use their phone and that is not practical for customers. There is no way to hold them to their word if they promise to not use as much, etc. (had a customer ask me if they promised to use less MTM, 10K worth, would we subsidize a ...
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The ones that arent making enough revenue will have to wait though, the system automatically re-classifies each customer on a cycle, from what I've heard its every three months, so even if the customer raised their plan, they would have to wait three months before the system would re-classify them at a higher level when it checks again. Just raising there plan wouldnt allow them to do it immediately, and that re-classification would work for anything, off network usage, high off peak usage, etc.... if they change their usage , once the system does its next sweep, they would be eligible, but most people arent able/willing to just change the entire way they use the phone so they can get a semi-annual discount.
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That is not exactly true. Those low revenue customers are being targeted with "better than new customer" deals to up their plan and immediately receive a subsidized handset.
While the normal upgrade qualifier might show LTV of 1 the VIP checker would show they are indeed eligible for an even better subsidy.
While the normal upgrade qualifier might show LTV of 1 the VIP checker would show they are indeed eligible for an even better subsidy.
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what's worse is my location ( agent) we could call customer service and "bump up" there upgrade by a month or so just so the customer gets new equipment, I get comm. on an upgrade, and Cingular gets 24 more months of money from them. But now If we get C.S. to bump up there upgrade date and we do the upgrade WE get charged back for it!!! Bu!!sh!t. And I'm not talkin about exception upgrades we could never do those anyways, just allowing them to upgrade a month early, it was never a problem before. Hey If I needed a new phone and had a month left on my contract and the store could not get me a new phone and sign a new two year and make me wait a month, Fu(k em I'll take my business else ware.
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You are misinterpreting the upgrade policy. If a customer has one month left we can upgrade them, all things being equal.
Yes we used to be able to call up and get that moved up if needed. To solve many problems in advance they just moved up the date to 3 months before the contract ends. Now if you are going to say "but why not another month early?" Sorry guy, but at some point you need to cut it off.
Yes we used to be able to call up and get that moved up if needed. To solve many problems in advance they just moved up the date to 3 months before the contract ends. Now if you are going to say "but why not another month early?" Sorry guy, but at some point you need to cut it off.
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Depends on WHY they are being excluded. They are not being excluded on a revenue basis so it is most likely usage patterns. If they incur significant off-network usage or huge MTM and N&W minutes then no.
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Question Tex:
How is a person to realize that they are an EON user? The alpha tag on all cingular phones sold for close to 2 years now stay fixed, reading "Cingular" at all times. I know that there's an "Off Network" alpha tag available, but the average customer doesn't even know what an alpha tag is! Should I start enabling all my customers with the Off Network tag?
Finally, never on any statement since roaming charges were abolished have I seen a section detailing how many min. were used off network. If this is indeed a problem why don't they let customers know that they're off network?
How is a person to realize that they are an EON user? The alpha tag on all cingular phones sold for close to 2 years now stay fixed, reading "Cingular" at all times. I know that there's an "Off Network" alpha tag available, but the average customer doesn't even know what an alpha tag is! Should I start enabling all my customers with the Off Network tag?
Finally, never on any statement since roaming charges were abolished have I seen a section detailing how many min. were used off network. If this is indeed a problem why don't they let customers know that they're off network?
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Hence the restrictions on where it can and cannot be activated.
We cannot activate customers who live outside our MSA. We also ask the question beforehand where they use the phone and inform them of the contract stipulations.
And the alpha tag is be added by customer service for problem customers. Most areas just don't have to deal with this issue so they aren't trained to handle the problem.
We cannot activate customers who live outside our MSA. We also ask the question beforehand where they use the phone and inform them of the contract stipulations.
And the alpha tag is be added by customer service for problem customers. Most areas just don't have to deal with this issue so they aren't trained to handle the problem.
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wow that really sucks. you go to verizon and want to add unlimited data on we'll let you upgrade early. I guess that's just one reason why our churn is lower..... yup
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Let me get this right, Cingular gets customers with its FREE night and weekends and MTM and them punishes them for using it. đ
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Basically. Maybe I should start selling Verizon.
It'd probably be easier.
It'd probably be easier.
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This is the logic.
Cingular offers unlimited nights and weekends and unlimited MTM. It costs them when you use it. The vast majority of customers do not use an amount that forces costs to exceed revenue. Those that do are not going to be offered a subsidy to stay. Why subsidize a customer who does not make you any profit?
There is no punishment, just no incentive to stay. If they are using that much it is not cost effective to switch carriers but they still can get a phone at roughly the dealer cost. Still not a bad deal at all.
Cingular offers unlimited nights and weekends and unlimited MTM. It costs them when you use it. The vast majority of customers do not use an amount that forces costs to exceed revenue. Those that do are not going to be offered a subsidy to stay. Why subsidize a customer who does not make you any profit?
There is no punishment, just no incentive to stay. If they are using that much it is not cost effective to switch carriers but they still can get a phone at roughly the dealer cost. Still not a bad deal at all.
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It's simple Tex.
You sometimes eat money or lose money in situations because on the other end you gain their friends and family. Cellphone service in more competitive areas like Dallas / Fort Worth are about friends and family. Just because my grandmother does not make them profit does not mean everyone else calling her is the same way.
I have switched more people to Cingular when I worked there than I did when I worked at Sprint because I liked Cingular service better. Not everyone in my family pays the bill I do but if one of my family members or one of my personal phones gets turned down. Cingular is going to not only lose that business but all of my business lines and every family member I can take with me. It is about respect for ...
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You sometimes eat money or lose money in situations because on the other end you gain their friends and family. Cellphone service in more competitive areas like Dallas / Fort Worth are about friends and family. Just because my grandmother does not make them profit does not mean everyone else calling her is the same way.
I have switched more people to Cingular when I worked there than I did when I worked at Sprint because I liked Cingular service better. Not everyone in my family pays the bill I do but if one of my family members or one of my personal phones gets turned down. Cingular is going to not only lose that business but all of my business lines and every family member I can take with me. It is about respect for ...
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Well, let's see.
I have recently sold in:
San Diego, Los Angeles, Phoenix, Las Vegas and DFW. The reason I mention West Texas is because we have a higher % of customers with a LTV of 1 because of our roaming situation. Bottom line, we deal with it more than ANYONE in the nation so we have a pretty good idea of how to handle the issue.
We aren't talking about a free CLA or extra bushels of apples here. Month in and month out these customers lose Cingular money. If they are not violating the terms of their agreement they are allowed to stay but it would just be foolish to subsidize a customer with whom you make no profit.
I also OWN my stores in which I sell so I understand the concept of referrals. I also understand how this ...
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I have recently sold in:
San Diego, Los Angeles, Phoenix, Las Vegas and DFW. The reason I mention West Texas is because we have a higher % of customers with a LTV of 1 because of our roaming situation. Bottom line, we deal with it more than ANYONE in the nation so we have a pretty good idea of how to handle the issue.
We aren't talking about a free CLA or extra bushels of apples here. Month in and month out these customers lose Cingular money. If they are not violating the terms of their agreement they are allowed to stay but it would just be foolish to subsidize a customer with whom you make no profit.
I also OWN my stores in which I sell so I understand the concept of referrals. I also understand how this ...
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No.
I look at it from a customer and business perspective. It is called greed. No matter how you look at it. No matter what spin you put on it Tex it is greed.
Cingular would never have done this if they were not #1. They do this every year. My question is if Cingular needs money so bad why not have some of the top guys take a little less money. I guarantee he could make up the difference quicker than the customers with what he makes. See that is the problem. Now I am the bad guy because I want the CEO of the company to be more responsible by taking less money and stop sticking crap to customers.
Phone companies are notorius for screwing people. They have been trying to gain control since the day "Ma Bell" was broken up and they ar...
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I look at it from a customer and business perspective. It is called greed. No matter how you look at it. No matter what spin you put on it Tex it is greed.
Cingular would never have done this if they were not #1. They do this every year. My question is if Cingular needs money so bad why not have some of the top guys take a little less money. I guarantee he could make up the difference quicker than the customers with what he makes. See that is the problem. Now I am the bad guy because I want the CEO of the company to be more responsible by taking less money and stop sticking crap to customers.
Phone companies are notorius for screwing people. They have been trying to gain control since the day "Ma Bell" was broken up and they ar...
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In the end this is a consumer driven economy. Cingular is number one and is now saying "what can you do for me" to it's customers. but in reality it should always be the other way around. To deny a customer who used the services that cingular promoted the same price on an upgrade as another customer because of profitability based on overage charges, addons, and other avenues of extra revenue, only accomplishes giving cingular a bad name. the truth is the wireless industry is extremely profitable and i sincerely doubt the the customers who were said to be unprofitable and costing the company money were anything more than a drop in the bucket of cingulars totals.
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even if the they were costing cingular 3 to 4 times what they were bringing in, it was only as a result of the the size of cingulars network and the advantages that were offered to them by cingular.
Cingular has spent millions trying to build its name. it might as well end up destroying it for all it cares at this point. they are number one and they are changing to AT&T. This is a business, and they are going to show people why business ethics doesn't mean a damn to them.
Cingular has spent millions trying to build its name. it might as well end up destroying it for all it cares at this point. they are number one and they are changing to AT&T. This is a business, and they are going to show people why business ethics doesn't mean a damn to them.
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Hey, what Adam Sandler movie was there where he went back to school...Billy Madison? Remember the final essay was "Business Ethics"...
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You just played your hand it you are very easy to read now.
It is not greed. It is about being profitable. I know of NO business that month in and month out they are willing to lose money on customers. PERIOD.
I would ask how they do this every year but I will probably get some slanted, anti-profit message from you that fits this same rant.
They are not screwing anyone. There is competition, in this industry to the tune of 5-6 carriers in most every market.
It is not greed. It is about being profitable. I know of NO business that month in and month out they are willing to lose money on customers. PERIOD.
I would ask how they do this every year but I will probably get some slanted, anti-profit message from you that fits this same rant.
They are not screwing anyone. There is competition, in this industry to the tune of 5-6 carriers in most every market.
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I think that the point st1x80 was originally trying to make is that there is no way for Cingular to accurately gague how much money someone REALLY brings the company. If I'm "unprofitable" due to my M2M, but I brought in 5 profitable customers who wanted to talk to me for free then all the telco sees is 6 separate customers, not my influence in bringing them business. If I can excercise the same influence on those 5 profitable customers, using simple fear of not being able to upgrade, when I get pissed off and leave (and believe me, fear is a hell of a motivator) then that's 1 unprofitable customer lost along with 5 profitable ones. Think about this on a NATIONAL scale, not just west Tex. and that's a LOT of people.
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Well I am glad to know 4 or 5 people understand the point even though Tex cannot see anything besides the $$ per person benefit.
Thank you disturbed.
BTW, Tex I make a damn good living running my business now. I am quite capable of understanding how to make money. I just realize what it takes to build the business which is the way everyone starts out. The key is learning to keep that same mentality and not say screw the customer I am big enough not to care now.
Thank you disturbed.
BTW, Tex I make a damn good living running my business now. I am quite capable of understanding how to make money. I just realize what it takes to build the business which is the way everyone starts out. The key is learning to keep that same mentality and not say screw the customer I am big enough not to care now.
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But if that guy is bringing in that much business he can get a new phone every year without signing any contract at all. It is called referral credits. I happen to offer a matching $25 per, so that is $50 per customer. No contract required.
And whether you guys like it or not, the BIGGEST influence on cost is off network usage. And the largest area effected by off network usage is... Bingo.
West Texas.
We deal with this issue in our area 3 to 4 times as much as any of you.
And whether you guys like it or not, the BIGGEST influence on cost is off network usage. And the largest area effected by off network usage is... Bingo.
West Texas.
We deal with this issue in our area 3 to 4 times as much as any of you.
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