Verizon Wireless Launching LTE in 38 Markets on December 5
WHAT A RIP OFF!!!
Sprint sell's their 3G/4G aircards with unlimited 4G for $59.99. No cap!!! Maybe Verizon's LTE will be a little bit faster, but from first hand experience, Sprint's 4G speeds are fast enough for PS3 online gaming with no lag at all...not to mention I'm sure gaming online uses tons of memory...last thing I'd wanna do is pay $10 for every extra gig of memory used...If Verizon actually cared about their customer's, they wouldn't charge an arm and a leg for a "capped" data service. 😕
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Oh wait. They don't.
Sprint's GAINING customers for the first time in years and they're still LOSING money. Clear is quickly running out of funds which will grind WiMax expansion to a halt really fast.
Verizon's not competing with Sprint here. They don't have to because sprint's currently NOT a threat. Yes their pricing IS better, but better pricing won't make them money if their pricing isn't profitable.
Having more customers is POINTLESS unless you're turning a profit. I WANT sprint to suceed, I really do. But if they follow their current pricing sceme they WON'T.
It's in EVERY Sprint customers best interest for Sprint to increase the pricing of their devices or implement usage caps if they don't they're sunk. Peri...
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Sprint's GAINING customers for the first time in years and they're still LOSING money. Clear is quickly running out of funds which will grind WiMax expansion to a halt really fast.
Verizon's not competing with Sprint here. They don't have to because sprint's currently NOT a threat. Yes their pricing IS better, but better pricing won't make them money if their pricing isn't profitable.
Having more customers is POINTLESS unless you're turning a profit. I WANT sprint to suceed, I really do. But if they follow their current pricing sceme they WON'T.
It's in EVERY Sprint customers best interest for Sprint to increase the pricing of their devices or implement usage caps if they don't they're sunk. Peri...
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In further challenging your thinking, Metro PCS continues to turn a profit with MUCH lower price points and only 7.9 million subscribers.
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What is their support for devices? How often do they give out BRAND NEW DEVICES for free to a customer three months after that customer got their last free device?
How many tech centers do they operate?
They don't subsidize the cost of their devices at all, so that's a HECK of a lot of gained income right there.
What is their coverage like? What do they charge for roaming? (hint, they do)
MetroPCS can't be compared to Sprint or Tmobile much less companies like ATT and Verizon who actually operate a majority of their networks natively.
Seriously. You are doing sprint NO FAVORS here.
How many tech centers do they operate?
They don't subsidize the cost of their devices at all, so that's a HECK of a lot of gained income right there.
What is their coverage like? What do they charge for roaming? (hint, they do)
MetroPCS can't be compared to Sprint or Tmobile much less companies like ATT and Verizon who actually operate a majority of their networks natively.
Seriously. You are doing sprint NO FAVORS here.
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You clearly have some outdated information on Metro.
They do subsidize handsets. Granted, we're not talking free high-end phones, but we are talking devices with a cost in the $100 neighborhood selling for $19. And with a $10 upgrade fee you can take advantage of this as much as you want with no contract.
As far as coverage goes, they have roaming agreements that allow a majority of users to use their phone wherever they need to go. You have to be in a fairly remote area to roam at $0.19 per minute. Have a look at their coverage map.
They do subsidize handsets. Granted, we're not talking free high-end phones, but we are talking devices with a cost in the $100 neighborhood selling for $19. And with a $10 upgrade fee you can take advantage of this as much as you want with no contract.
As far as coverage goes, they have roaming agreements that allow a majority of users to use their phone wherever they need to go. You have to be in a fairly remote area to roam at $0.19 per minute. Have a look at their coverage map.
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Sounds like Verizon circa 2003-2004. I would guess that they have a lot less overhead than Big Red and iPhone Blue, just like Verizon back six or seven years ago.
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On a per user basis Verizon doesn't have THAT much overhead than 2003-2004...even after the buying spree they went on.
If we're being honest, AT&T and Verizon have come together to keep prices high while claiming that Sprint and T-Mobile are competition.
If we're being honest, AT&T and Verizon have come together to keep prices high while claiming that Sprint and T-Mobile are competition.
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And if that's the case, report it to the FTC or FCC and let the government add it to the pile.
AT&T copying Verizon's plans isn't market manipulation, it's competitive matching. If Sprint and T-Mobile, the latter of which has always been in the value category, don't follow suit, it's their own decision to do so. That doesn't make a Verizon/AT&T conspiracy theory true.
AT&T copying Verizon's plans isn't market manipulation, it's competitive matching. If Sprint and T-Mobile, the latter of which has always been in the value category, don't follow suit, it's their own decision to do so. That doesn't make a Verizon/AT&T conspiracy theory true.
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T-Mobile has always had a need to be in the value category due to size. When merger mania took place they were simply left in the dust.
You cannot say with any honesty that if we had 5 or 6 similar size carriers as we did in the past that prices would be this high or plans this in line.
You cannot say with any honesty that if we had 5 or 6 similar size carriers as we did in the past that prices would be this high or plans this in line.
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I think they're all high, even the value carriers. I think this is because of the business model they all use, which is severely lacking in common sense. So yes, I do think it would be the same with five equal-sized carriers, because they're all equally flawed.
Imagine this for one moment - something I've talked about in an article on my site. If I have a $40 plan for 450 minutes, why do overage minutes cost five times more than the minutes in my allowance? Did I incur extra fees to the carrier by going over my minutes? No. They simply make a killing off of it. Even the initial cost of minutes, roughly 8.8 cents/minute in my example, are much more than five times the cost of the call. In my old business, that would equate to a 80%...
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Imagine this for one moment - something I've talked about in an article on my site. If I have a $40 plan for 450 minutes, why do overage minutes cost five times more than the minutes in my allowance? Did I incur extra fees to the carrier by going over my minutes? No. They simply make a killing off of it. Even the initial cost of minutes, roughly 8.8 cents/minute in my example, are much more than five times the cost of the call. In my old business, that would equate to a 80%...
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Do you remember the Fair & Flexible plan? It didn't seem to work. Customers were confused.
I'm an advocate for unlimited everything. Going back to Metro for a minute, $35 per line for unlimited everything in a family situation seems pretty reasonable to me. That $35 includes taxes, fees, and BS so there are never any surprises. And you know what, Metro works for me.
I'm an advocate for unlimited everything. Going back to Metro for a minute, $35 per line for unlimited everything in a family situation seems pretty reasonable to me. That $35 includes taxes, fees, and BS so there are never any surprises. And you know what, Metro works for me.
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Let me ask you...
Do you get take-out buffet for free when you eat at the buffet?
Do you get charged a huge finance charge on credit card purchases not paid within 30 days?
This isn't really all that big of a deal. While I agree that overages completely suck and credit card fees are ridiculous, I also signed on the dotted line. I knew what those charges would be when I signed up. I knew what my plan was and how many minutes I was allowed to use. All carriers offer offer plans with more minutes and most carriers offer some sort of overage relief if I'm not mistaken. They can call in and either change their plan or just purchase extra minutes. As far as I'm concerned, this contracts should just call it a "moron" fee. "Look, Moron, we ga...
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Do you get take-out buffet for free when you eat at the buffet?
Do you get charged a huge finance charge on credit card purchases not paid within 30 days?
This isn't really all that big of a deal. While I agree that overages completely suck and credit card fees are ridiculous, I also signed on the dotted line. I knew what those charges would be when I signed up. I knew what my plan was and how many minutes I was allowed to use. All carriers offer offer plans with more minutes and most carriers offer some sort of overage relief if I'm not mistaken. They can call in and either change their plan or just purchase extra minutes. As far as I'm concerned, this contracts should just call it a "moron" fee. "Look, Moron, we ga...
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Did I say anything about personal responsibility? I don't disagree that when someone makes an agreement, both for the contract, but also for the minute plan, they take on the responsibility of their own usage.
I'm not sure where you lose track of the conversation, but it has little to do with personal responsibility.
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I'm not sure where you lose track of the conversation, but it has little to do with personal responsibility.
adcd1a said:
You cannot say with any honesty that if we had 5 or 6 similar size carriers as we did in the past that prices would be this high or plans this in line.
Then, I said:...
I think they're all high, even the value carriers. I think this is because of the business model they all use, which is severely lacking in common sense. So yes, I do think it would be the s
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epik said:...
Did I say anything about personal responsibility? I don't disagree that when someone makes an agreement, both for the contract, but also for the minute plan, they take on the responsibility of their own usage.
I'm not sure where you lose track of the conversation, but it has little to do with personal responsibility.
And then I gave the example of overages as one indication that modern wireless plans made little sense.
My point wasn't that people shouldn't be responsible for their own usage, and as such, their overages. My point was, the overage rates make little sense.
Perhaps, ten or fifteen years ago, it made more sense. Today, the cost per minute is nominal. The difference between 450
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I am not young. My first cell phone was a unit installed on a company truck in 1997. I paid out the rear for it.
To be honest with you, based on the tone of your comments over the last couple months, I thought you were young. My apologies.
I've also been in business for quite some time. I know all to well that what you did ten years ago rarely works today. The base $0.45/minute overage hearkens back to a day when there wasn't unlimited minutes for $30 more. It's time for overage rates to change, or unlimited minutes for all. Given that in two years unlimited has gone from non-existent, to $100/mo, to $70/mo, it's an inevitability. I'm not assuming it will come tomorrow, but in the next few years for sure.
You know, landline ...
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To be honest with you, based on the tone of your comments over the last couple months, I thought you were young. My apologies.
I've also been in business for quite some time. I know all to well that what you did ten years ago rarely works today. The base $0.45/minute overage hearkens back to a day when there wasn't unlimited minutes for $30 more. It's time for overage rates to change, or unlimited minutes for all. Given that in two years unlimited has gone from non-existent, to $100/mo, to $70/mo, it's an inevitability. I'm not assuming it will come tomorrow, but in the next few years for sure.
You know, landline ...
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I completely understand where you are coming from regarding how much they charge for overage compared to what they charge for unlimited.
My kid had an ATT phone once with 5M of data per month and he went over by quite a bit ...the bill was $1200.00... by comparison the unlimited data plan for his phone was $15.00... Luckily ATT worked with me and just charged me for the unlimited plan, but it took some arguing. My point is that even though those prices were ridiculous, it's their right to charge them. It is really the ONLY way carriers actually make money on their customers. It's no more fair than a redneck cop pulling you over on a stretch of highway that is 35mph for a 1/4 of a mile... but the speed limit sign is there and if I didn't wa...
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My kid had an ATT phone once with 5M of data per month and he went over by quite a bit ...the bill was $1200.00... by comparison the unlimited data plan for his phone was $15.00... Luckily ATT worked with me and just charged me for the unlimited plan, but it took some arguing. My point is that even though those prices were ridiculous, it's their right to charge them. It is really the ONLY way carriers actually make money on their customers. It's no more fair than a redneck cop pulling you over on a stretch of highway that is 35mph for a 1/4 of a mile... but the speed limit sign is there and if I didn't wa...
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If the company only makes money on overages, then the company is royally screwed. That really makes no sense. People don't go over enough to bring in billions of dollars of profit. If they did, they'd drop Verizon and go somewhere else.
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epik said:
If the company only makes money on overages, then the company is royally screwed. That really makes no sense. People don't go over enough to bring in billions of dollars of profit. If they did, they'd drop Verizon and go somewhere else.
Ask anyone who works behind the scenes at one of the carriers... they will all tell you the same thing: they don't make money on customers for almost 2 years.
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epik said:
AT&T copying Verizon's plans isn't market manipulation, it's competitive matching. If Sprint and T-Mobile, the latter of which has always been in the value category, don't follow suit, it's their own decision to do so. That doesn't make a Verizon/AT&T conspiracy theory true.
Price matching is only "competitive" matching in marketplaces where sufficient competition exists and there are more then enough independent suppliers to meet product demand.
The American cellular industry does NOT fit that model.
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CellStudent said:
Price matching is only "competitive" matching in marketplaces where sufficient competition exists and there are more then enough independent suppliers to meet product demand.
The American cellular industry does NOT fit that model.
Someone paid attention in ECON 101.
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acdc1a, I did pay attention in economics.
Price fixing is knowingly structuring your prices with your competitor to gain a hold on market revenue and block out other "competitors," which is what you were insinuating. The notion that Verizon and AT&T "got together" at some point to fix prices is ludicrous.
CellStudent, thank you for pointing out that I had used improper terminology.
What I meant to say was AT&T or Verizon mimicking each other's pricing structures is merely to stabilize their portion of the consumer market, avoiding destabilizing price wars. I was attempting to respond to acdc1a's comment:
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Price fixing is knowingly structuring your prices with your competitor to gain a hold on market revenue and block out other "competitors," which is what you were insinuating. The notion that Verizon and AT&T "got together" at some point to fix prices is ludicrous.
CellStudent, thank you for pointing out that I had used improper terminology.
What I meant to say was AT&T or Verizon mimicking each other's pricing structures is merely to stabilize their portion of the consumer market, avoiding destabilizing price wars. I was attempting to respond to acdc1a's comment:
If we're being honest, AT&T and Verizon have come together to keep prices high while claiming that Sprint and T-Mob...
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"Which sounds like an accusation of price fixing to me."
Would it make you feel better if I said AT&T and Verizon have bought out the competition to keep prices high?
Would it make you feel better if I said AT&T and Verizon have bought out the competition to keep prices high?
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AT&T in its present form and Verizon in its present form are a result of merger after merger. Mergers limit competition, is this a fair statement?
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I guess that would depend on how you're viewing it.
Mergers limit the number of players in a market, but also stimulate competitors to do more to compete.
Cingular bought AT&T WS, became the biggest player in the market. That pushed Verizon to do better. Years later, Verizon bought Alltel and become the biggest player, pushing the new AT&T to compete more. T-Mobile, on the other hand, didn't want to play that game and were fine with their place in the market (they tell you this on day one of new employee hire). Sprint was somewhere in between, but I'd say it's safe to say that the last two years at Sprint have been a result of wanting to compete with Verizon and AT&T.
So do merger's limit competition? From the above point of ...
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Mergers limit the number of players in a market, but also stimulate competitors to do more to compete.
Cingular bought AT&T WS, became the biggest player in the market. That pushed Verizon to do better. Years later, Verizon bought Alltel and become the biggest player, pushing the new AT&T to compete more. T-Mobile, on the other hand, didn't want to play that game and were fine with their place in the market (they tell you this on day one of new employee hire). Sprint was somewhere in between, but I'd say it's safe to say that the last two years at Sprint have been a result of wanting to compete with Verizon and AT&T.
So do merger's limit competition? From the above point of ...
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There is so much competition in this market that it is ridiculous. Even Wal Mart came out with their own MVNO, Straight Talk. I dont know how anyone can say that the cellular landscape in the US is not competitive. I work in a retail store every day and see the competition.
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i would say there is some competition out there, but walmart's cell phone service hell no cause you know that. since its walmart they are goin to screw you over every way possible, just they do thier own employees
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You make some good points.
But...
I'm only going to speak in generic terms here man, but you have to believe that Dan Hesse has a long term plan.
Admittedly, Sprint was a HUGE cluster %^&* when he arrived, but the guy single-handedly turned it around and implemented a plan to change it. Everyone is already seeing the results. That's a huge ^5 in my book.
The iDen network is slowly going away. The long term plan has always been to convert it to CDMA. That has been the #1 money vacuum for Sprint: two networks. The expense of running them while being innovative = money loss.
You would think that this might sound like bad news, ironically it isn't. Sprint's value is up on Wall Street. Their numbers are better than they have ever been. S...
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But...
I'm only going to speak in generic terms here man, but you have to believe that Dan Hesse has a long term plan.
Admittedly, Sprint was a HUGE cluster %^&* when he arrived, but the guy single-handedly turned it around and implemented a plan to change it. Everyone is already seeing the results. That's a huge ^5 in my book.
The iDen network is slowly going away. The long term plan has always been to convert it to CDMA. That has been the #1 money vacuum for Sprint: two networks. The expense of running them while being innovative = money loss.
You would think that this might sound like bad news, ironically it isn't. Sprint's value is up on Wall Street. Their numbers are better than they have ever been. S...
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Most people don't think long-term. You are right though. Sprint has the upper-hand because of all the Spectrum they own.
Its mind-blowing to think that they have almost FOUR times all the other networks combined. This fact alone will help Sprint drive into the future and eventually (hopefully) become the number one carrier.
Dan Hesse is the main reason why I am not too worried about their current status. He is a freakin wireless genius!
Its mind-blowing to think that they have almost FOUR times all the other networks combined. This fact alone will help Sprint drive into the future and eventually (hopefully) become the number one carrier.
Dan Hesse is the main reason why I am not too worried about their current status. He is a freakin wireless genius!
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