Reliability is NOT cheap!
My, aren't we living in a big brother is watching and wants an explanation for everything you're doing environment! 😈
I am in complete agreement raising the etf from $175 to $350 on advanced devices. These phone are not cheap, some retail for $599! Cell sites, are not cheap. Google estimates it cost approximately $1 million for every new cell site & then approximately $10k to $20k a year in maintenance. I don't have any figures for switching stations, but I'm sure they're not cheap either! And lets not forget the employees, they need to make money too! After all, Verizon is in the business to make money (but unlike government taxes, are fees and service charges are optional!) Verizon was getting ripped off by greedy consum...
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I am in complete agreement raising the etf from $175 to $350 on advanced devices. These phone are not cheap, some retail for $599! Cell sites, are not cheap. Google estimates it cost approximately $1 million for every new cell site & then approximately $10k to $20k a year in maintenance. I don't have any figures for switching stations, but I'm sure they're not cheap either! And lets not forget the employees, they need to make money too! After all, Verizon is in the business to make money (but unlike government taxes, are fees and service charges are optional!) Verizon was getting ripped off by greedy consum...
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Just because a device retails for $599, it does not mean that Verizon paid that price.
I am not in wireless business, but I can tell
that a $4,000 Rolex watch cost less than $500
to produce.
I am not in wireless business, but I can tell
that a $4,000 Rolex watch cost less than $500
to produce.
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if that is true that doesn't mean anything. if it only cost 500 to produce then rolex sells it to someone else (retailer) for more (maybe 1000-1500). and then they put the sticker on it that says 4,000. then somebody comes in and says i'll give you 3,000 for it. so then you have to take that profit and pay your bills with it. and ur right, verizon didn't pay 599 for it. they paid 550 for it. how would you feel if you sold a Droid or BB to someone for 50 bucks expecting to make the money back and then they bail out on you!
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but you're looking at it backwards.
a rolex has a brand attached to it, a brand customers are willing to pay for.
with a phone, it's completely different, because while there is a brand associated with the product, most customers are unwilling to pay more than 200 for a phone, no matter how awesome (and there are even more customers who refuse to pay more than 100, or even 50). So you have an artificially low price expectation.
Carriers are willing to foot the rest of the bill because contracts are lucrative. When I got my first phone, I paid 100 for it, a phone that I couldve got retail for 220 or so. So the discount wasn't that bad. But now even a basic flip phone (5500) is selling for 200 or so under retail.
The differen...
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a rolex has a brand attached to it, a brand customers are willing to pay for.
with a phone, it's completely different, because while there is a brand associated with the product, most customers are unwilling to pay more than 200 for a phone, no matter how awesome (and there are even more customers who refuse to pay more than 100, or even 50). So you have an artificially low price expectation.
Carriers are willing to foot the rest of the bill because contracts are lucrative. When I got my first phone, I paid 100 for it, a phone that I couldve got retail for 220 or so. So the discount wasn't that bad. But now even a basic flip phone (5500) is selling for 200 or so under retail.
The differen...
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What I was trying to say that anybody can put
a any retail price.Do you buy anything at MSRP?
Just because Verizon sets a retail at $599,, it does not mean that they actually paid $200.
I will say one thing, that I am not familiar
with wireless business, but in any other business, you do not pay retail, not at least
here in NY, there too much competition. I honestly don't believe that a phone most likely made in Asia cost that much money, even with all the R&D included. The prices for all
electronic devices are dropping every other day,so why would be different for wireless devices, please convince me.
a any retail price.Do you buy anything at MSRP?
Just because Verizon sets a retail at $599,, it does not mean that they actually paid $200.
I will say one thing, that I am not familiar
with wireless business, but in any other business, you do not pay retail, not at least
here in NY, there too much competition. I honestly don't believe that a phone most likely made in Asia cost that much money, even with all the R&D included. The prices for all
electronic devices are dropping every other day,so why would be different for wireless devices, please convince me.
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Menno said:
but you're looking at it backwards.
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The difference between watches and phones is that the cost of the device isn't the deciding factor when it comes to the retail cost because phone companies can charge wireless companies as much as possible for a popular phone because they know the customer will rarely (if ever) see that price.
This is NOT correct. The problem with "MSRP" on cell phones is that it's not an MSRP, it's a CMRP, "Carrier Mandated Retail Price" that is NOT set by free market conditions!
The largest failure in cellular handset pricing (particularly in CDMA devices) is that there is no wholesale, unbranded marketplace.
There is absolutely ZERO technological restric...
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I think I finally understand, people are trained to tell customers that the carriers are doing them a favor by subsidizing their phones. So now the customer is indebted to the carriers, anyone here every watch the godfather? So when the carrier restricts certain things the customer is supposed to be ok with it because “hey we did you a favor by paying for part of your phoneâ€Â. So the consumer that knows that they do not pay “retail†for anything should now be happy to get what they get from the cell phone company. I bet General Motors wish they had come up with this business model.
The bottom line is that VZW is a business, they are not going to lose money to “help†the consumer. If you believe that VZW i...
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The bottom line is that VZW is a business, they are not going to lose money to “help†the consumer. If you believe that VZW i...
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I think the Godfather analogy is little extreme, but you get the idea. The cellular market in America is basically a collection of segmented monopolies that supply a similar service.
That needs to change.
That needs to change.
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Yes, and I really wish it would change in the near future. Is there any real movement in the direction you outlined to create a more competitive market? I know organizations like Consumers Union are trying, but I don't know if they've had much influence.
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Until someone can build their own wireless network, all this arguement is pointless...and getting kinda old.
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It would be pointless if the wireless carriers were not subject to government regulation (minimal though it is), but they are. It is not necessary to "build your own wireless network" - only necessary to muster the political will to force a more equitable business model on the wireless industry. It's debatable which is more difficult though 🙂
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"muster the political will to force a more equitable business model on the wireless industry"
Wow! Maybe the Feds should just take over and run the wireless industry?
Who wants to run a business where the rules are changed mid-stream at the whim of politicians? What is the CEO of AT&T going to say? "I would not have committed to buying spectrum for billions if I realized you were going to tell me how to use it after the fact?" Seriously... I actually hate that they are hoarding that AWS spectrum personally, but it would be wrong for the Feds to come in NOW and say use it by such and such date or we are taking it back. Fortunately (thanks to Google) time restrictions for use were placed on the 700mHz spectrum BEFOREHAND. That's...
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Wow! Maybe the Feds should just take over and run the wireless industry?
Who wants to run a business where the rules are changed mid-stream at the whim of politicians? What is the CEO of AT&T going to say? "I would not have committed to buying spectrum for billions if I realized you were going to tell me how to use it after the fact?" Seriously... I actually hate that they are hoarding that AWS spectrum personally, but it would be wrong for the Feds to come in NOW and say use it by such and such date or we are taking it back. Fortunately (thanks to Google) time restrictions for use were placed on the 700mHz spectrum BEFOREHAND. That's...
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No, it's very expensive to run a reliable network. But that's not the contra-argument that's being presented against the ETF increase. Verizon was beaten at its own game by smart consumers and the only solution to the problem was either make the handset purchase a real free market endeavor (over their dead body) or make the ETF high enough to stop people from gaming the system.
The problem with the carrier subsidy is that it obscures the real price and prohibits the consumer from shopping around. Coupled with carrier exclusive deals and nearly *no* way to easily purchase handsets without direct market intervention by the carrier, the consumer really doesn't know how much a handset costs other than the "retail" price given by the carrie...
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The problem with the carrier subsidy is that it obscures the real price and prohibits the consumer from shopping around. Coupled with carrier exclusive deals and nearly *no* way to easily purchase handsets without direct market intervention by the carrier, the consumer really doesn't know how much a handset costs other than the "retail" price given by the carrie...
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"So the next time you are the only one in your circle of friends who can actually use their cell phone for making and receiving calls, think about the good folks at Verizon Wireless and rest assured that your hard earned money is going to make sure you can always use your phone"
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Being grateful for reliability and questioning Verizon's pricing policies are not mutually exclusive. I would like Verizon (and all the other cell carriers as well) to be fair and transparent with regard to their charges. The FCC apparently agrees, and while you're feeling generous consider sending a little love their way too. As representatives of the "public good" they are one of the few forces that can exercise restraint on the telecommunications companies....
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Being grateful for reliability and questioning Verizon's pricing policies are not mutually exclusive. I would like Verizon (and all the other cell carriers as well) to be fair and transparent with regard to their charges. The FCC apparently agrees, and while you're feeling generous consider sending a little love their way too. As representatives of the "public good" they are one of the few forces that can exercise restraint on the telecommunications companies....
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