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confused about ETF

peacebe2me

Jul 7, 2011, 12:54 PM
My contract expires April 2013. So at that time I can just go to another cell phone company with no fees owed to Verizon?

So the possible 0.03 cents a month charge they are discussing is for early termination fees only. Since I'm not leaving Verizon then I really don't need this, correct? Unless there is some kind of fee for leaving after my contract expires than this three cent monthly fee would apply towards that?

Here is a site I was reading.

http://www.droid-life.com/2011/07/07/verizon-ups-reg ... »
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erikpkp

Jul 7, 2011, 1:38 PM
This fee increase is from VZW, not the gov't. VZW and any other carrier charges fees because the gov't charges them. The raise is in a fee that you pay directly to VZW. By raising this fee you are entitled to terminate your service and switch to another carrier with out being charged an ETF. So VZW is saying that they will credit you the $.72 to keep you as a customer. But if they deny you the right to leave that inistelf is a breach of the contract.

"Can Verizon Wireless Change This Agreement or My Service?
We may change prices or any other term of your Service or this agreement at any time,but we'll provide notice first, including written notice if you have Postpay Service. If you use your Service after the change takes effect, ...
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peacebe2me

Jul 7, 2011, 1:57 PM
In very plain Jane terms, customers can use this to get out of their contracts for free?

What are my fees after my contract expires though?

I did call Verizon. But they are experienceing high call volume and my wait time was 47 min.
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acdc1a

Jul 7, 2011, 2:13 PM
Yes, in general this is a material change that allows you to leave early. It happened to me with Sprint. Getting out of the contract world and not being tied down any longer has been great for me.

Perhaps you may wish to use this to your advantage and consider your options. If you still find Verizon works best for you, no harm.
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erikpkp

Jul 7, 2011, 5:55 PM
if you let your 24 months expaire then you go month to month with the same fees. just because your out of your contract doesnt mean the fees dissappear.
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mekong77

Jul 7, 2011, 2:58 PM
Not to rain on your parade, but you are incorrect. While it is a material change, if you call and cite the fee increase as your reason for leaving, they will credit you the 3 cents per line, per month for the remainder of your contract. By doing this, they are no longer in breach, so if you still choose to cancel you WILL be charged the ETF and you WILL NOT get it waived. Sorry...
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erikpkp

Jul 7, 2011, 5:54 PM
and that again is a breach of contract, why is ok for sprint to do it that way and not vzw, I had a lawyer (my grandfather) look that over and confirmed that how it works.

Yes VZW can credit you for it, and they will try but its not up to them, its up to the customer according to the contract that they provided and the customer signed. there is no loophole to the loophole.

Sorry to rain on your parade.
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erikpkp

Jul 7, 2011, 5:58 PM
As a question was posed eariler in this thread, they will credit you the fees back for the remainder of the CURRENT CONTRACT, but what about beyond that CURRENT CONTRACT. That it why thise clause exists.
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mekong77

Jul 8, 2011, 8:20 AM
I don't care what your lawyer grandfather thinks about it. VZW WILL NOT waive your ETF for this. It's not my opinion. It's policy. They haven't waived ETFs the last few times the regulatory fee increased and that will not change with this increase. Please stop setting false expectations for other posters. It just makes you look silly and uninformed. Thank you.
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acdc1a

Jul 8, 2011, 10:25 AM
When arguing the legal merits of the MATERIAL CHANGE you usually will be able to get out of it regardless of POLICY.

The credit back does not constitute anything other than goodwill from the company. It does nothing to negate the MATERIAL CHANGE to the contract.

It doesn't look like this poster will switch, but that changes nothing...I don't even need to show it to my uncle, brother, cousin, sister, mother, attorney.
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erikpkp

Jul 9, 2011, 9:52 AM
The regulatory fees are mandated by the gov't if they go up then VZW goes up. There is not clasue for waiving of etf for reg. fees. The material fees are something that VZW charges themselves to the customers, not because the gov't says so. Read your policy.
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erikpkp

Jul 9, 2011, 10:14 AM
In rereading the article is does mention reg fees, but it doesn't mention that it was passed down by the gov't. If the gov't passed it down then your completely right, you cannot get out of a contract because the gov't raised the fees to VZW, but if VZW is raising them on thier own then its fair game.
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CellStudent

Jul 9, 2011, 9:23 AM
Find me a clear unambiguous, authoritative definition of "material change" and I'll answer your question.

I have had no luck finding such a definition, but I'll admit I don't personally care much so I didn't look very hard.
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erikpkp

Jul 9, 2011, 10:00 AM
Definition:

A change in the meaning or language of a legal document, such as a contract, deed, lease, or Commercial Paper, that is made by one party to the document without the consent of the other after it has been signed or completed.

And (again) VZW's Policy

Can Verizon Wireless Change This Agreement or My Service?

We may change prices or any other term of your Service or this agreement at any time,but we'll provide notice first, including written notice if you have Postpay Service. If you use your Service after the change takes effect, that means you're accepting the change. If you're a Postpay customer and a change to your Plan or this agreement has a material adverse effect on you, you can cancel the line of Service that ha...
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OrionsVantage

Jul 9, 2011, 10:02 AM
So if Verizon credits .03$ then there is no adverse effect, right?
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erikpkp

Jul 9, 2011, 10:03 AM
Thats what they would do to keep you from switching. Yes but that would only work for the rest of the current contract. If you were to renew again the $.03 charge returns and there is not crediting.
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OrionsVantage

Jul 9, 2011, 10:10 AM
But renewing means a new contract, right, therefore negating this whole material change deal anyway.
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erikpkp

Jul 9, 2011, 10:12 AM
That is correct.
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OrionsVantage

Jul 9, 2011, 10:14 AM
Ok, so how are people going to use this to get out of their contract?
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erikpkp

Jul 9, 2011, 10:15 AM
Its a raise in fees that the customer has no control over.

Can Verizon Wireless Change This Agreement or My Service?

We may change prices or any other term of your Service or this agreement at any time,but we'll provide notice first, including written notice if you have Postpay Service. If you use your Service after the change takes effect, that means you're accepting the change. If you're a Postpay customer and a change to your Plan or this agreement has a material adverse effect on you, you can cancel the line of Service that has been affected within 60 days of receiving the notice with no early termination fee.
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OrionsVantage

Jul 9, 2011, 10:29 AM
You keep posting this same thing over and over but you're not really answering the question. if Verizon hangs a -.03$ modifier on your bill there is not material adverse affect to the consumer, closing the loophole.
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epik

Jul 9, 2011, 10:41 AM
I see both points being used in this overall thread.

On one hand, the change DOES have an adverse monetary effect on the consumer, and is quite obviously a breach of the contract and should give the consumer a way out of the contract, without fees, if they so desire.

On the other hands, the change is being adjusted, which in the past has usually gotten carriers around the material change aspect of the contract. The nature of the adjustment, however, is different than in the past - previously, if the regulatory charge was raised, something was lowered to accommodate it, creating a zero monetary change. In this case, the effect is similar, but through a different means.

The problem stems from the ambiguous nature of this section of ...
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