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Apple Delivers iPhone

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why no cdma

disland

Jan 9, 2007, 2:26 PM
Did Sprint and verizon miss the boat on this one? Was Apple too hard to work with?
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otsego

Jan 9, 2007, 2:30 PM
cdma is inferior... also apple wants to distribuite this phone world wide (obviously).. and GSM is considered a world standard.... only the US is behind in this one.. plus VZW and sprint suck.
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denzillion

Jan 9, 2007, 2:31 PM
CDMA inferior???

You better put your fire suit on buddy boy.
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otsego

Jan 9, 2007, 2:32 PM
bring it.
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SprintPCSGuy

Jan 9, 2007, 3:07 PM
CDMA vs. GSM

There are many models of Treo smartphone, from the old Handspring 180 to the newest Palm Treo 700p, but within these models there are two important distinct types of handset: GSM and CDMA.

For instance, a Treo 600 could be a CDMA or GSM handset, and the difference is very important!

The digest for lazy readers: GSM and CDMA are two types of mobile phone network. GSM is used all over the world, CDMA is largely restricted to the USA and North America. CDMA is often faster for data but using data blocks voice calls. GSM data is often slower but doesn't block voice calls. Tri and quad band GSM phones (like the Treo) can be used all over the world, CDMA phones can't. GSM phones use SIM cards, CDMA phones don't.

Why You Sh...
(continues)
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AshDizzle

Jan 9, 2007, 3:10 PM
too long to read
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SystemShock

Jan 9, 2007, 3:12 PM
AshDizzle said:
too long to read

As opposed to your comment, which was too useless to post? Or should've been. Razz
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phonenvy

Jan 11, 2007, 10:40 PM
I like cake.
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jnichols959

Jan 9, 2007, 8:26 PM
disagree. i thought is was very good info. put it my del.icio.us for reference.
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ebaydan777

Jan 9, 2007, 10:45 PM
ok thank you for this very long explanation...could you please explain then why cingular has the fewest dropped called, because up there you stated cdma has the fewest..which is untrue statistically in the united states (cdma's own home)....but thanks for the explanation im still buying the damn phone its sick as hell and i could give a **** what service is on it...everything works near me so im happy
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z34007

Jan 11, 2007, 8:44 PM
I'm still waiting for Cingular to explain how they have the fewset dropped calls.
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ndulacd

Jan 14, 2007, 11:18 PM
Its easy to explain. Cingular doesn't offer service in as many locations as VZW. In the city they are both great. There are some areas of the country though that barely get VZW service but don't get any Cingular coverage. Because the VZW coverage isn't that great, there are more dropped calls in those areas. But the fact remains that VZW at least gets SOME coverage there where Cingular doesn't get any. If I'm in a larger area that gets both, it doesn't matter b/c neither has many dropped calls, but if I'm stuck in some out of the way place, I would rather have at least some coverage with VZW and suffer from some dropped calls than not have any coverage at all with Cingular. That's why Cingular has the fewest number of dropped calls. ...
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Djanifer9512

Jan 10, 2007, 12:19 AM
Sounds good, couldn't have said it better myself. However, what makes you believe that CDMA phones tend to get better battery life? Call me crazy, but as long as I've been selling cell phones, I've never once needed to sell an extended life for a non-pda gsm cell phone. Example, I work in Baltimore where it is half & half Verizon/Cingular. How come it's only the Verizon customers that I see with those fat extended life batteries on their Razrs? How come the GSM Treo 650 gets batter battery life than the CDMA Treo 650?
Are these just minor oversights on your part? Or are just partial to Sprint? Personally, I've never used a CDMA handset so I would never argue call quality with you (excluding the "fewest dropped calls campaign"), of cou...
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ebaydan777

Jan 10, 2007, 12:38 AM
i love you Djanifer9512, hahahaha GO GSM AND iPHONE!!!
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Lie

Jan 15, 2007, 6:08 PM
What really is humorous is that until about a year or so ago when Verizon Wireless got the RAZR, there wasn't a single phone in the store that could sustain more than 1 day of battery life on standby. Maybe a day and a half with any extended battery.

I went and asked one of the employees if they had any phone with great battery life and he looked at me and shook his head as if I was crazy. With Verizon, about all you are paying for is CDMA.

The iPhone went with Cingular for the customer base and advantage of being able to go across seas this year with GSM. Thats it. Not because it's so much better than CDMA.
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SkillciaX

Jan 13, 2007, 10:08 PM
Telephia did a study and said so.

To me it doesn't matter because even if you have coverage everywhere... the strength of signal isn't the same everywhere... Just go with what works best for you, not just because of some ad campaign...
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davewho

Jan 15, 2007, 1:04 AM
http://www.boston.com/business/articles/2006/05/14/f ... »

--
Telephia sent a letter this month to officials at all four major wireless companies, saying it didn't know how Cingular concluded that it drops the fewest calls. The San Francisco research firm also said it couldn't say whether Cingular's advertising is fair, legal, or responsible.
--

And it's impossible to prove because Telephia isn't talking.
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Omagus

Jan 9, 2007, 2:34 PM
I hate getting into the whole CDMA vs GSM debate. The fact is that both of them have their strengths and weaknesses. One is only "better" than the other if it serves YOUR needs.

That being said, it makes all the economic sense in the world to make this phone GSM. Simply put: if it's CDMA, you can sell to the nation; if it's GSM, you can sell to the world.
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Makaveli258

Jan 9, 2007, 2:40 PM
Wow
You are an idiot for saying CDMA is inferior. And saying that Verizon and Sprint suck, is an ignorant and idiotic statement. When I had GSM It was garbage, but saying that it is inferior to CDMA would be a stupid.

Please get the hell off the forums.

Thanks
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djdanska

Jan 9, 2007, 3:00 PM
While im not going to say that verizon or sprint sucks, i see why they picked gsm. The vast majority of the world uses gsm. Maybe it would cost too much to make a cdma version for verizon/sprint. Besides, verizon is known for limiting features of their phones. For them to take a phone with no features stripped would be a big shocker. It's not that any given technology sucks, it may have just cost less.
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AshDizzle

Jan 9, 2007, 3:14 PM
Yeah I'd really like to see a VZW iPhone. It would just not have OSX, and all options would be disabled because heaven forbid people DO WHAT THEY WANT WITH THEIR PHONE.

You are all suckers with VZW with your locked down phones. Meanwhile, I'll enjoy filesharing over bluetooth and infrared with my real phones.
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SystemShock

Jan 9, 2007, 3:16 PM
Hey if Cingular didn't suck so hard in my area, I'd give 'em a try. But VZW blows 'em out of the water where I live, so I go with them.

Fix your network and your CS, and I'll give ya a try. Not 'till then, tho'. Sad
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AshDizzle

Jan 9, 2007, 3:18 PM
Move then.
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SystemShock

Jan 9, 2007, 3:22 PM
Nope. Get your toolbelt on and build some towers, stat. Very Happy
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matrix2004

Jan 9, 2007, 8:41 PM
Buddy, wipe that brown GSM stuff from your mouth. You can't believe the crap they tell you,seriously...GSM while it is used worldwide is very inferior to CDMA. It's not even worth arguing over it, there is nothing to discuss.
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HEKNOWS

Jan 9, 2007, 9:52 PM
this goes for the first post sprint and vzw sucks are you on drugs oh oh i get it you are are Laughing
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foneguy

Jan 15, 2007, 10:24 AM
Faster data, better call quality, more secure, turn by turn navigation, better technology, hmm...yeah CDMA is SOOOO much worse that than slower GSM.

Keep your GSM I stick with CDMA, along with Japan, the mid east, most of Asia, etc...
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japhy

Jan 9, 2007, 2:36 PM
Jobs' point was that they wanted to grab the widest market possible. Making a phone that works on American CDMA limits their options considerably. With a GSM device, they can sell it to most of the world with no modification. That's the cold hard fact of CDMA - the smaller customer base is a big disadvantage.
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crossedsignals

Jan 11, 2007, 11:10 PM
Total Number of GSM subscribers (Worldwide): 2.23 Billion
(Source: GSMworld.com)

Total Number of CDMA subscribers (Worldwide): 700 Million
(Source: CDG.org)

Total number of handsets sold worldwide last year: 946 Million
(Source: Apple/Jobs keynote)

Estimated proportion of total sales by technology:

GSM: 746 million handsets
CDMA: 200 million handsets

Apple's 2008 Sales Goal: 10 Million Units

If you were in charge of Apple's marketing and sales, which market would you rather sell to? The one where you can meet your sales goal with a 1.3% share or the one where you have to gather 5% of the market...for the same amount of revenue. I'm sure the costs of gathering a 5% share might be a little more than 1.3% and th...
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foneguy

Jan 15, 2007, 2:59 PM
Finally, and intelligent answer.

Though, you didn't list WCDMA or CDMA2000 in those figures. That bumps the total number of CDMA users up quite a bit because of Japan and Korea alone, nevermind China, Israel, and other middle eastern, and Asian countries that use CDMA technology.

I think China alone had 250 million CDMA users according to some poll somewhere (though I suspect it's actually far less, and this was a publicity grab, but who knows)
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japhy

Jan 15, 2007, 6:49 PM
Hey, I thought I had an intelligent answer. Crying or Very sad But I didn't have the figures, so I can see your point. Smile

It should be mentioned that WCDMA/UMTS should be grouped with GSM (since it's the evolutionary step from GSM), and that Korea should be considered a separate market, as they use different frequencies of CDMA.

I'm highly suspicious of the China figure: that's almost a quarter of the population. Keep in mind how many people in China live in rural/semi rural areas, who'd have no use for a cell phone, much less the income to afford one. All that for CDMA only? Meaning GSM is significantly more? I doubt it.
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foneguy

Jan 15, 2007, 8:04 PM
No, I still think GSM has CDMA beat for total number of users, but I think that CDMA isn't that far behind.

I found the poll that I was refering too, and I'm going to see if I can find an online version of it. It was an est. 250 million people have a cellular phone in China, with 100 million confirmed, all CDMA technology. I would guess that these are people in, and around Bejing, and Hong Kong.

WCDMA and GSM are not the same. GSM is moving toward WCDMA, but they are two entirely different animals. WCDMA is launching out of CDMA2000, which if think of it like this, it all makes sense: CDMA2000 and GSM got together and produced kids. WCDMA/UMTS (they're not the same thing but close enough for this topic) is the end result. Think ...
(continues)
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Versed

Jan 9, 2007, 3:06 PM
1. Apple sells to a global market, CDMA is basically North American and a few other places. So they know it will sell in the US, Canada, EU and other countries with GSM.

2. Could it be possiable that VerizonWireless and Sprint are hard to work with?
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djdanska

Jan 9, 2007, 3:14 PM
I can see the iphone with that weird verizon interface.
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SystemShock

Jan 9, 2007, 3:14 PM
I'm sure it'll be like the situation with the RAZR- it'll come to CDMA eventually. By then the price will be nice too. Cool
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AshDizzle

Jan 9, 2007, 3:15 PM
Oh like when the RAZR came to VZW and it was 299.99 on 2 year? And cingular had it for 99.99?
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SystemShock

Jan 9, 2007, 3:21 PM
Boo hoo... so Moto charged the same introductory price on VZW they did on Cingular and elsewhere. Is it 299.99 now? Nope, heck its $49.99 now on VZW. The price fell pretty quickly after VZW got it too.

Like I said, I'd consider Cing, but VZW's network clobbers theirs where I am. Get a network and some good CS and then I'll care about you getting some phones a lil' earlier.
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Bigbmc26

Jan 9, 2007, 4:16 PM
cingular and motorola charged $499.99 when the v3 first came out. $299.99 was a deal!
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SystemShock

Jan 9, 2007, 4:36 PM
Bigbmc26 said:
cingular and motorola charged $499.99 when the v3 first came out. $299.99 was a deal!

$499.99 and all it was was a phone??? Dang. Shocked
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Bigbmc26

Jan 9, 2007, 4:39 PM
yep, 2004 $499 with the 2yr, no rebate and they flew out the door!
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Wireless Buddy

Jan 9, 2007, 7:45 PM
because they were thin and movie stars and rappers had them Laughing
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Bigbmc26

Jan 9, 2007, 7:47 PM
yep!
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crossedsignals

Jan 11, 2007, 11:23 PM
A long time....Cingular's exclusive is 'multi-year' (I think I remember it as 3 years from the keynote).

It's doubtful (though possible) that we'll see a CDMA version for Korea before the US version.
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staiano

Jan 9, 2007, 4:28 PM
Except if Jobs doesn't want deal with Verizon and how they disable all the features on their phones.

A few problems:
- running osx and their menu system and not verizon's?
- Google maps included, then you don't have to pay for verizon's version?
- imap email include then you don't have to pay verizon?
- bluetooth 2.0 with edr???

I just can't see a CDMA version of this phone.
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SystemShock

Jan 9, 2007, 4:37 PM
People said there'd be no CDMA RAZR too. Ah well. Cool
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staiano

Jan 9, 2007, 4:43 PM
I'm not saying there won't be a CDMA iPhone ever but you should admit it's easier to put out a GSM version of this phone first.
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smittythepig

Jan 9, 2007, 3:44 PM
they're probably the most important countries in the world (aside from the US) in terms of consumer electronics.

CDMA isn't just in the US and a couple of other 3rd world countries.

that being said, i totally see why they would make a GSM version first. hopefully it will eventually come to CDMA. knowing Apple i am guessing that it will.
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Omagus

Jan 9, 2007, 4:38 PM
They're the most important markets in the world regarding consumer electronics...EXCEPT for wireless devices. I would argue that Europe is the pioneering market there. Regardless though, 3/4 of the worldwide wireless market is GSM. It only makes sense to start off there. And if it truly is a lifelong exclusive type thing, then it makes sense to use GMS as well.
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sangyup81

Jan 9, 2007, 11:26 PM
Sorry folks, Korea and Japan are going the UMTS route for 3g, not EV-DO.
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darksyde00

Jan 11, 2007, 4:30 PM
Actually, Japan is mainly WCDMA, which is really not the same thing, despite the name. It's closer to UMTS.
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brownte

Jan 9, 2007, 3:55 PM
This is a marketing issue, not a technology one. Cingular marketing is making all the right moves (First Blackjack, First Blackberry pearl, Exclusive on the Nokia E series........). Exclusives are pretty commonplace -- Sprint and Verizon have taken turns on who has gotten the latest/greatest Treo the last few years.

However this is a multi-year agreement, and I doubt if Cingular is subsidizing the price of the handsets *and* Apple fans tend to pay sticker no matter what. Don't count on these ever being cheaper until Apple releases iPhone 2.
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SystemShock

Jan 9, 2007, 4:09 PM
"Multi-year agreement" prolly means "ends in early 2008". Wink
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algorithmplus

Jan 15, 2007, 2:21 PM
If I'm not mistaken from Apple's keynote, it means ends in 2009.
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Phantom1359

Jan 9, 2007, 9:34 PM
Cingular and Apple already have an agreement to do iTunes through Cingular as it is. So making this phone to their company was a give in
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HEKNOWS

Jan 9, 2007, 9:39 PM
just let the fever of gsm user cool down and by the 3rd qrt of this year or next this phone will be out on cdma the question is it will be vzw or sprint to be honest vzw Confused won t get it cause the have the chocolate line up i think it will be sprint sadly
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RUFF1415

Jan 9, 2007, 9:40 PM
Cingular has a US exclusive on this phone through 2009.
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LordObento

Jan 9, 2007, 11:49 PM
Maybe Mac will make another Iphone model for CDMA. Personally... I wouldn't pay $600 GSM or CDMA versions. I really doubt VZW will get it because they dont support iTunes like Cingular did.
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Phantom1359

Jan 9, 2007, 9:46 PM
Personally...I don't want it..."Fad phones" are not what I go for. They have to prove worthy to get it (i.e 8600 fixed some problems of the 8300). The problem to fad phones is they go so deep with fun add-ons that the phone itself tends to be horrible. Especially when it's a company just entering the market for cellular. I can honestly say, if it doesn't come to vzw, so what...i'm still gettin the 9400 after a few months so that the bugs are fixed Very Happy
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ebaydan777

Jan 11, 2007, 6:59 PM
worthy to get? u must obviously be the cell-phone god...right?? right??
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