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AT&T to 'Pause' Network Investments in Net Neutrality Fight

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So I read the OPED by TED CRUZ and....

Zpike

Nov 14, 2014, 4:26 PM
Ted Cruz is being an alarmist idiot.

Here is what Ted Cruz said about net neutrality:

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"And one of the biggest regulatory threats to the Internet is “net neutrality.”

In short, net neutrality is Obamacare for the Internet. It would put the government in charge of determining Internet pricing, terms of service and what types of products and services can be delivered, leading to fewer choices, fewer opportunities and higher prices."
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Now leading up to this he said a lot of good stuff about internet taxes and ICANN and preventing foreign powers from controlling the internet. That...
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Zpike

Nov 14, 2014, 5:44 PM
I really don't know why they took down your response to me or my response to you. But I wasn't the one who complained about it. I never do that sort of thing in any type of debate or dialogue.
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Slammer

Nov 14, 2014, 5:53 PM
My guess is to replicate what carriers would be allowed to do if given control of the net. He probably didn't fork over enough money to allow his opinion to be read.

But, joking aside, I didn't find anything he said offensive enough to be mediated off. I rather welcomed his point whether I agreed with him or not.

John B.
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planethulk

Nov 14, 2014, 6:13 PM
Lol. It isnt the carriers who would dictate that. It would be government rules and regulations.
Free markets would mean that if ATT or any other ISP pulled the nonsense that we have been warned about, then people would be free to dump them on their butts. And that would cause Att to change their policies. Government on the other hand would have the 'law' on their side and would just impose its will on you regardless of if you were right or wrong.
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Slammer

Nov 14, 2014, 7:21 PM
---"Free markets would mean that if ATT or any other ISP pulled the nonsense that we have been warned about, then people would be free to dump them on their butts."----

Who would you go to? As it stands every one of these carrier are trying to push the limits as we speak. Tmobile is just trying to attract customers, Sprint is in a position to try even harder. Guess what carriers that hold most of the marketshare, are always trying to keep customers locked into their clutches by raising ETFs, bait and switching, all while trying to keep the FCC and DoJ off their backs? This industry is currently designed to have the smaller carriers race to the bottom so the two largest bell offspring can once again rule you and control what you do. And if...
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planethulk

Nov 15, 2014, 2:23 PM
Who would you go to? There are literally 100's of carriers and ISPs.
Not only would NEW Startups form but existing competition would use the unpopular policies to their advantage and sell it.
Want to TRULY destroy competition? Want reall monopoly? Make them 'Utilities' just as Obama is proposing. How many electric companies are available to you? Water companies? Gas companies? In 99% of America there is only one available for the area. So yeah let's do that. Ugh.

Much of your argument seems to stem from the idea that these Corporations are inherently evil. Id like to see what you claim these evils are and cite real life examples. Honestly, just hating them doesn't prove your point.
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Zpike

Nov 15, 2014, 1:14 AM
>>Free markets would mean that if ATT or any other ISP pulled the nonsense that we have been warned about, then people would be free to dump them on their butts.

Please enlighten us all on your plan to create this market where we have viable choices for ISP's and can just dump an ISP when we decide we don't like them. Surely you're not suggesting we currently have a free market where ISP's are concerned (hint: I'm baiting you so you will show your crony capitalism colors). The internet has been rife for over a decade with case after case after case of people who want to leave their ISP and have no viable alternatives. Please explain either how that constitutes a free market in your mind or how you propose we transform that into a truly f...
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planethulk

Nov 15, 2014, 8:34 PM
"The internet has been rife for over a decade with case after case after case of people who want to leave their ISP and have no viable alternatives."

Please cite examples. I'll wait here.

"ISP's are already doing that. Is it only wrong if the government does it?"

Please cite examples.

When I say cite examples, an appropriate response would be a link to an article that at least agrees with you. I'm sure all we will get is "Everyone knows it's the truth and I don't have to do that".
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Zpike

Dec 3, 2014, 6:19 PM
A quick internet search produced this:
http://www.digitaltrends.com/opinion/its-time-to-get ... »

Also, here's a thread on reddit where regular every day people are complaining about internet monopolies:
http://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/1 ... »

And here's another article:
http://www.extremetech.com/internet/178465-woe-is-is ... »

And here's another:
http://www.wired.com/2013/07/we-need-to-stop-focusin ... »

And another:
http://www.inquisitr.com/183990/op-ed-when-your-isp- ... »...
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planethulk

Dec 3, 2014, 7:01 PM
There is really no need for me to respond to you since you will undoubtedly report anything I say as an insult and get my response deleted by your twitter buddy.
I have reported several instances of your insults and inflammatory behavior to no avail. Rich Brome seems to think it is okay for you to behave this way and/or he has some personal grudge against me. I dont really care to debate the issue with you as it isnt really a debate if you have all my points deleted. I find yours and Rich's behavior appaling and it only reflects the low hit counts the site receives. The masses do not come here for phone info anymore and they certainly dont come to the forums when the select few are allowed to behave how they wish.

I could certainly pro...
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Zpike

Dec 4, 2014, 12:29 PM
>>There is really no need for me to respond to you since you will undoubtedly report anything I say as an insult and get my response deleted by your twitter buddy.
I have reported several instances of your insults and inflammatory behavior to no avail. Rich Brome seems to think it is okay for you to behave this way and/or he has some personal grudge against me. I dont really care to debate the issue with you as it isnt really a debate if you have all my points deleted.


Let's set the record stariaght.

1. I don't have a twitter account and I have never posted a single thing on twitter in my entire life.

2. Rich and I could hardly be considered friends. I have had at best 4 or 5 conversations with him in my entire life, and all of ...
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planethulk

Dec 4, 2014, 8:54 PM
I have no real incentive to convince someone who is being combative and dismissive of my ideas of anything to the contrary.

I would provide links to each and every example of how this is actually you describing yourself, but you will just report it as an insult and have your lil buddy delete it.

I don't have any desire to debate you any longer for previously described reasons. You don't have any positions that haven't already been defeated by Capitalist economists for well over a century.
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Zpike

Dec 5, 2014, 12:32 AM
>> You don't have any positions that haven't already been defeated by Capitalist economists for well over a century.

LOL. OK, then. Since those guys actually have something to say, they can feel free to debate me themselves. Yawn. Next ungracious loser please.
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planethulk

Dec 6, 2014, 5:39 PM
I have already debated you. Already defeated your lame arguments. And now you do nothing but troll me. You trolling me is all the satisfaction I need. Lol. Keep obsessing on me.
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Zpike

Dec 6, 2014, 8:10 PM
Wait. Didn't you throw a temper tantrum and leave?
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planethulk

Dec 7, 2014, 11:30 PM
No. That was you. You got exposed and only came back a week later when you cried to the moderators to remove several of my posts that proved you lied. And really the only reason I reply to you is because I feel sorry for you. You obviously have no one in your life that cares about you so you have latched onto me like a barnacle on a great white shark. I have no real interest in debating anything meaningful with you, but I will be glad to point out your broken psyche as you obsess over me.
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Zpike

Dec 4, 2014, 12:53 PM
I posted the articles above in hopes that you might actually say something of substance.

For the record, I maintain that ISP's enjoy near monopolistic power in the market and that people don't feel there are any viable alternatives.

You disagreed and stated that there were adequate alternatives. Furthermore, you insisted that I produce references that supported my view point.

I have produced several articles in the hopes that you would explain how you maintain your perspective in the face of an overwhelming sentiment from the technology sector that there is little choice and competition among ISP's.

But instead of responding with any rebuttal or conceding the point and adjusting your perspective, you have opted to contrive some ...
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planethulk

Nov 14, 2014, 6:07 PM
Yeah. I got an email too....tho I havent used that email in years. I updated it so hopefully the next time one of the over zealous hall monitors chooses to censor me, I will actually get to hear their lame excuse for doing it.
I suspect it is because I defended Ted Cruz against your comment of him being an alarmist idiot. It isnt okay for me to call you an idiot, but it is okay for YOU to call Ted Cruz an idiot according to their amazing logic. I suspect that it is because the moderators don't like Ted Cruz. Rich and Eric being East coast liberals, it isn't a surprise. They have been picking and choosing who they censor for years now and it won't stop anytime soon. They also represent EXACTLY what the so called 'Net Neutrality' means: the e...
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Zpike

Nov 14, 2014, 6:11 PM
>>They also represent EXACTLY what the so called 'Net Neutrality' means: the elite few get to decide the rules and then they will enforce them how they see fit.

If you educated yourself on this misconception of yours about net neutrality, then we could probably continue our dialogue. But as long as you continue to think that is what net neutrality means we will be talking about two entirely different things. It is painstakingly obvious at this point that you are not from a technological background and don't fully understand what proponents of net neutrality are asking for or why.
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planethulk

Nov 14, 2014, 6:24 PM
Man. I was at the forefront of the debate YEARS before you ever heard of it.
Like I said. Net Neutrality is what we currently have. How on earth do you think adding government takeover will benefit anyone?
It is you who do not understand what it is. The exact same people who told us that Government can fix health care and make it better and cheaper and more readily available are the exact same people who are propagandizing government enforcement of Net Neutrality. It is also exactly why Ron Paul and his son were against it in 2012! When government says 'Net Neutrality' it isnt what you think it is. I cant wait for Pelosi to say "We'll find out what it means after we pass the law". Worked out well before didnt it?
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Zpike

Dec 4, 2014, 3:03 PM
So, I'll try this another way.

>>Man. I was at the forefront of the debate YEARS before you ever heard of it.

Well, the debate can honestly be traced back to the inception of TCP/IP. So, I'll let you elaborate on what TCP/IP is, how packets are put together, and what all that means to net neutrality. Since you were on the forefront of the debate, you should obviously be able to explain the technology and relate that back to why you don't think we need net neutrality. I'm here waiting for you to back up what you just said.
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planethulk

Nov 14, 2014, 6:29 PM
Seriously...
You have blundered through the definition of capitalism, anarchy and net neutrality. Really, you are batting a big goose egg here.
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Zpike

Nov 15, 2014, 12:57 AM
>>You have blundered through the definition of capitalism

Hardly. Just because I don't buy your flavor of crony capitalism as the real deal doesn't mean I don't get it. Why don't you go camp with Ted Cruz and the rest of the Republican morons who have been screwing up capitalism for the last 20 years.

>>anarchy

I never said anything about anarchy except that I'm not interested in it. I'm sorry if my disinterest in your fantasy world disqualifies me as a rational human being in your opinion. Then again, I'm really not.

>> net neutrality.

You can continue your delusional fantasy all you like. Keep on pretending that crony capitalism is the real deal and that AT&T is the pinnacle of the capitalist dream all you like. You can con...
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planethulk

Nov 15, 2014, 3:09 PM
Says the guy who claims to be a 'libertarian' but doesnt know who Rothbard, Rockwell, Mises or anything about Austrian Economics. And even more strawman attacks. Ron Paul fan? No you are a bandwaggoner. You dont even know Ron Paul endorsed Ted Cruz. Lol.
You are nothing more than a democrat who pretends to like Ron Paul. Take a hike.
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planethulk

Nov 14, 2014, 6:49 PM
Again I will point you to an article wriiten by a Free Market Capitalist Economist and published on a Capitalist Economics website.
http://www.lewrockwell.com/2014/01/robert-wenzel/net ... »

Feel free to read it. I doubt you will. Im sure you will also claim he isnt an economist or a capitalist.
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Zpike

Nov 15, 2014, 3:03 AM
I did read that article. And it was terrible. Robert Wenzel may or may not know economics, but he certainly doesn't know technology. All of his conclusions about how the internet works are blatantly false. I could easily refute them, but I refuse on principle.

If you can't be bothered to make the points for yourself, I certainly won't waste my time refuting them. I'm rapidly losing my faith you would comprehend the refutations anyway.

But if this crap article and that crap piece by Ted Cruz is the kind of disinformation you regularly feed on, it's no wonder you're so confused about the meaning of net neutrality.

Now I challenge yo to go do some academic (non archo-economics) reading on the structure of the internet. Feel free to al...
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planethulk

Nov 15, 2014, 2:12 PM
Actually, you have been lying since you started interacting with me. So no surprise there. You have no expertise on any subject you keep bringing up be it economics or technology.
You are also the one using ad hominem and straw man attacks. Maybe you dont know what strawman is but when I dispute something you actually say, that isnt a strawman.
Your little shtick may impress your drinking buddies, but your lack of knowledge is apparent to anyone who doesn't get their info from wiki articles. Milton Freidman is an "archeconomist"? (Im assuming you meant anarcho. Dont trip over those big words). No Freidman is THE expert on Capitalism and Economics. Even experts who hate him will tell you that he was the man on Economics. The only people I c...
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Zpike

Nov 15, 2014, 5:14 PM
Let's keep a tally of YOUR lies.

>>Actually, you have been lying since you started interacting with me.

Lie number one. I am completely honest about what I think and haven't intentionally misrepresented anything, although YOU have.

>>Milton Freidman is an "archeconomist"?

Lie number 2.

Haha, who's the liar with the straw man again? I never mentioned Milton Friedman. You did. And I never classified him as anything. But you just keep right on knocking those staw men over, ok.

>> (Im assuming you meant anarcho. Dont trip over those big words).

Funny, I made a typo at 2:00 in the morning and you pounce on it. Typical of little school boys with nothing of substance to say when their masters aren't around.

>>The only peopl...
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planethulk

Nov 15, 2014, 3:11 PM
2am, eh? Awesome friday night activity there, slick. What happened? Did your date find out you were a fraud too or was your mom on a date so you were allowed to use her,computer?
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Zpike

Nov 15, 2014, 5:23 PM
>>2am, eh? Awesome friday night activity there, slick. What happened? Did your date find out you were a fraud too or was your mom on a date so you were allowed to use her,computer?

Haha. Typical troll. Nothing of substance to say so make inferences about my character. What's even funnier is that you just couldn't resist making this post after telling me bye in your last one. More troll behavior from you.

It has been fun watching you degenerate from someone who sounded like he was knowledgeable to an incoherent troll. But that is what happens when you press elitist snobs who derive their entire perception of the world from books and confine themselves to the comforts of those who say what they want to hear. It comes to the surface rath...
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planethulk

Nov 16, 2014, 1:30 PM
You trolled me specifically, here:

https://www.phonescoop.com/articles/discuss.php?fm=m ... »

You trolled me specifically, even by name here:

https://www.phonescoop.com/articles/discuss.php?fm=m ... »

You trolled T-Bone here (and he wasn't even part of the conversation AND since he offered no opinion on the subject YOU created a strawman to attack instead) :

https://www.phonescoop.com/articles/discuss.php?fm=m ... »

You trolled this guy and even insulted him and of course in your hypocrisy, you offered no rebuttal only insult and some misguided idea that you are the foremost expert on anything:

https://www.phonescoop.com/articles/discuss.php?fm=m ... »

Hell, that...
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Zpike

Dec 2, 2014, 2:10 PM
>>You trolled me specifically, here:
https://www.phonescoop.com/articles/discuss.php?fm=m& » ...

Actually I trolled Ted Cruz, and his yes man took the bait.

But really I wasn't even trolling. I was responding to an article you mentioned on a prior thread and decided to start a new thread for it. I posted several paragraphs explaining what was wrong with Ted Cruz's op-ed. Rather than refute any of it you just labeled me a troll. Real mature there

>>You trolled me specifically, even by name here:
https://www.phonescoop.com/articles/discuss.php?fm=m& » ...

Ummmmm... apologizing that one of your posts was taken down and offering assurances that I wasn;t the person who complained about your post could hardly be considered trolling. But...
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