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Verizon Wireless Sued Over V710 Bluetooth Limitations

Article Comments  100+  

Jan 17, 2005, 1:23 PM   by (staff)

Verizon Wireless is being sued in a California court for "willful, deceptive and oppressive conduct" in limiting the Bluetooth functionality of the Motorola V710. The suit was filed by law firm Kirtland & Packard, who is seeking class-action status for the suit. While the V710 supports three Bluetooth profiles, it does not inlcude the OBEX profile, which would allow users to exchange files between the phone and other devices. The suit claims Verizon misled users by advertising that the phone can "connect to your PC or PDA whenever and wherever you want". Verizon spokeswoman Brenda Raney claims the limitation is required by the company's agreements with BREW software developers. Meanwhile, Bluetooth SIG executive director Michael Foley spoke out against Verizon, saying "[We are] very disappointed in this (Verizon's) implementation decision and believes [sic] many consumers who purchased [the V710] for the Bluetooth capabilities are frustrated and confused as a result." In response, the SIG plans a new "best of breed" designation for Bluetooth phones that implement Bluetooth functionality beyond the most basic profiles.

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schnozejt

Jan 17, 2005, 1:44 PM

Rock and a Hard Place

Seems like VZW was stuck in between BREW developers and customers; VZW would been sued either way, for example if the V710 had full all profiles enabled then VZW would of been sued by the BREW developers.

Oh and the statement, "connect to your PC or PDA whenever and wherever you want." That's true--> you can connect to your PC or PDA to connect to the internet, that's is all. When I read that statement I don't automatically assume in can connect to my pc or pda to UPLOAD/DOWNLOAD OBJECTS.
Yeah thats true. I have never used a v710 but I can imagine how pissed everyone is. I transfer videos pictures and MP3s to my phone all the time.
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schnozejt said:
Seems like VZW was stuck in between BREW developers and customers; VZW would been sued either way, for example if the V710 had full all profiles enabled then VZW would of been sued by the BREW developers.

Oh and
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schnozejt said:
Seems like VZW was stuck in between BREW developers and customers; VZW would been sued either way, for example if the V710 had full all profiles enabled then VZW would of been sued by the BREW developers.

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Go get em. Do you hear me now.
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Personally, if I were in charge of P/R or VZW legal dept., I would be less worried about some tech-savvy (or slightly more tech-informed) customers suing my company, than I would worry about a company (developer) and the chance they may have multiple ...
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hahahaaa
Connect to your computer any where any time is acutualy a lie. If all you can do it connect for dialup networing ..then when you are in the extended network/anolog or no service you cant CONNECT,So at that point you cant really connect to anything whi...
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What bothers me the most about this mess is that no matter who said what, the loopholes are in place, and Verizon will walk away without paying a dime. They'll pay for it in all of the negative exposure from the media and their customers will be runni...
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Not to sound like a jerk toward any of the wireless agent stores out there, or anyone else, but how do you know that it was only VZW sales reps that misrepresented this product? I know this topic has been beaten to death, and no one else may even car...
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schnozejt

Jan 17, 2005, 3:36 PM

Kirtland & Packard Has Got Nothing

They have absolutely no evidence. What are they going to say? Your honor, it's VZWs fault for not realizing that people assume.

People get upset when their lack of knowledge or assumptions slaps 'em in the face. Just realize and be happy that VZW made most people smarter consumers--> next time you read "connects to your pc or pda," you will QUESTION "to do what?" Next time you see a product w/ a special feature you might research that special feature untill you fully understand all of its parameters.

But back to the point, Kirtland & Packard have no evidence; they will get an "A" for effort.
Are you dumb or blind? It says on VZW's website the phone can hook up to your computer. That's false advertising... deceptive at the very least.

VZW deserves to be sued. They are cooks, plain and simple, and they exist solely to screw people out of...
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I went into the verizon store today and was told by the store manager that the phone can indeed connect to your PC via Bluetooth and download and upload what you want.....

Maybe they have not heard but the phone has been disabled.

When I ques...
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Oh it connects to your pc to ummmm, help you wash the dishes..WTF do you think its supposed to connect to your pc for?? M-O-R-O-N..
petemcroy

Jan 17, 2005, 3:45 PM

Verizon should be shut down, but this is a good start.

If you saw: "use bluetooth to connect your phone to your PC or PDA"

... and knew that almost all other BT phones could send files back and forth over BT.....

What would you assume?

Verizon is the crooks of the wireless industry. From locking people out of their own phones with BREW ("Screw You Now" Services... that offer no benefit to the consumer over Java) , to lying about their service "America's Best Network" , I hope Verizon gets their rear handed to them on a golden platter.
Thats the problem...people assumed. No one should ever assume. Your keywords were "almost all other BT phones..." Exactly, not every bluetooth phone has the OBEX profile. For instance, T-Mobile's Blackberry 7100t does not have the ability to transfer ...
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What is that saying that people use when they assume. they make somthing out of you and me.
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petemcroy said:
If you saw: "use bluetooth to connect your phone to your PC or PDA"

... and knew that almost all other BT phones could send files back and forth over BT.....

What would you assume?

Verizon is the crooks of
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Actually, Verizon does have industry-leading ineffective call attempt percentages, and industry-leading dropped call percentages. Cingular is a close second. Sprint is up there. Nextel and ATT are abysmal, pretty much. Widest coverage + least drop...
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This thread kind of reminds me of the Pac-10 conference in the early 1990's. The entire conference could not compete with the Washington Huskies and so they trumped up a charge to put them on probation.
Shortly after that there were t-shirts in Seat...
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staiano

Jan 26, 2005, 2:24 PM

Interesting little article

joachim

Jan 20, 2005, 5:11 PM

Moto V710

all this talk about this phone, makes me want to buy one. Very Happy sounds like a good phone
Despite everything you see here in the forum, if you dont need to connect to your pc, this phone is a good phone. check the reviews for more information. (P.S.: they fixed the issue with the camera)
joachim said:
all this talk about this phone, makes me want to buy one. Very Happy sounds like a good phone
It is a good phone. Excellent reception, a beautiful interior screen, and nice audio quality are just a few of its feat...
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HeroPsychoDreamer

Jan 26, 2005, 10:36 AM

Just a quick question...

Why are people still posting about this matter? I mean, is there anything remotaly new to discuss? After 517 posts (518 after I post this), wouldn't you think that everyone has already spoke their mind at least 5 times over about this subject?

I really have nothing against it, post away. I'm glad for all that find this topic so fascinating. But really, and I'm being serious, hasn't everything that there was to cover been covered already, like, more than once?

Just curious...
pcrisp07

Jan 17, 2005, 1:45 PM

Why sue when you can switch?

It's about time something is done about this. But I believe that a company has a right to do this to any product it sells. I think that if someone is not satisfied with this they should just switch companies. Love being able to use my v551 with my headset, computer or any other BT device.
its called false advertising
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That's why I left VZW. I couldn't stand there lieing and ripping customers off.
Mad
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....Its called number portability and at least a 15 day trial to test the phones features.

The V710 isnt *that* great of a phone, nor is Verizon that great of a carrier. Sounds like someone has a bit too much time on their hands.
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thats exactly why i didnt go with VZW when they came out with the V710. their service is great, but the fact that i cant transfer files/photos is pretty crappy i think. good thing i looked up the phone specs before i went into VZW to switch! Razz
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That would be great if the coverage of the other providers were as good. I travel a good bit and have had MCI, AT&T, Cingular, and all had lots of dropped calls in areas that my Verizon does not. That is where verizon gets you. I wish Cingular had the...
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Verizon and teh "brew" have been very frustrating at best, because of the disabiling of features and bluetooth functions, I switched from Verizon to AT&T. Was I happy to do so?? NO but because of the idiots at Verizon who want to control everything on...
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bkw79

Jan 17, 2005, 11:33 PM

This is the reason for disabling bluetooth capabilities!!!!

If Verizon enabled file transfer with bluetooth, people could and would rip verizon off. Verizon offers it's GETITNOW services for ringtones and games and wallpapers. If file sharing through bluetooth was enabled, that would give one customer full freedom to pay for a download, and send them to as many other customers that he or she wants, instead of everyone purchasing it if they want it. Its just like me buying computer software, and making a copy for my buddy, instead of him buying his own. It would hurt the software company, and its illegal. Yes people burn illegal copies all the time, but is it really fair? All customers may not go to get it now and buy a ringer, or game, and send it to others, but I guarantee you that majority of...
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If there were other choices then you would be right. With competition comes lower prices. When Verizon dictates who you can go to then that is where the problem is. There are lots of other companies offering games, ringtones etc, but can't be download...
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bkw79 said:
If Verizon enabled file transfer with bluetooth, people could and would rip verizon off. Verizon offers it's GETITNOW services for ringtones and games and wallpapers. If file sharing through bluetooth was enabled, tha
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Im a sprint customer..and have the LG bluetooth slider phone..so Iknow why you disable BT" makes tons of money. It makes perfect sense to disable the file trasfer stuff for revenue...buts its how they go about doin it..that people get mad about. Say ...
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bkw79 said:
If Verizon enabled file transfer with bluetooth, people could and would rip verizon off. Verizon offers it's GETITNOW services for ringtones and games and wallpapers. If file sharing through bluetooth was enabled, tha
...
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so bluetooth could possibly be used for illegal file transfers, so it's evil and should be shut down? HELLO! you are on the internet! there is massive potential for fraud with your web browser, mouse, pc, laptop, phone line etc. you better turn them a...
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60660

Jan 24, 2005, 3:30 PM

OMIGOD PLEASE LET IT END!!!!!!!!!!!!

HOW MANY TIMES CAN EVERYONE IN HERE KEEP STARTING NEW THREADS JUST TO ARGUE THE SAME POINT BACK AND FORTH!!! I BET YOU VERIZON ISN'T EVEN HALF AS WORRIED ABOUT THIS LAWSUIT SOME OF YOU ARE!! LET'S ALL JUST LET IT DIE NOW, IT OVER...ITS NOT EVEN NEWS ANYMORE LOL. MOVE ON...LIVE YOUR LIVES LOL
your adding to it dude with your new Post! let people talk about it all they want. if you feel this is hurting you in some way..Stop reading it...now 'go away' leave people be..word brah.peace Laughing
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well if i understand this place correctly most of the people here are in the phone industry so this is there life isnt it??
shadedpain4

Jan 24, 2005, 2:06 PM

Closing in on 500....

When this thing gets to 500 posts, party at my place. Everyone bring your Verizon Wireless phones. We're all going to get drunk and ingest our VZW cell phones. Then we are going to sue VZW for not putting a "Do not eat your cellular phone" disclaimer on the boxes or contract.

Good times ahead. Well good times, intestinal discomfort, and eventually surgery, but you get the idea. Smile
Ha ha ha, this reminds me of the lawsuit against those giant tupperware containers, now they post "Do not put child in container and seal lid" on them because some "misinformed" customer thought it would make a nice crib, and sued. (if you dont believ...
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shadedpain4 said:
When this thing gets to 500 posts, party at my place. Everyone bring your Verizon Wireless phones. We're all going to get drunk and ingest our VZW cell phones. Then we are going to sue VZW for not putting a "Do no
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shadedpain4 said:
When this thing gets to 500 posts, party at my place
Well, if the post count ont eh front page is any indication, I'm post # 502. So, where's the party? I'll go buy a Verizon phone so I won't feel ...
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VWO4L

Jan 23, 2005, 3:08 PM

This is how I understand this whole deal

It seems to me that this all boils down to a lack of research on the customer's behalf. Just like commercials for mutual funds say 'Past performance is no guarantee of future returns'. It works the same way here, just because many other previous BT phones have had all the profiles available does not mean that every future phone will as well. I won't argue whether or not that is right, but I think that it is up to each individual company to make that decision on the phones they sell.

The company is not(and should not be) responsible for the ignorance or lack of product education that their customers posess. I will agree that perhaps VZW should have made a footnote when referencing the BT capabilities of the 710 and said perhaps, 'PC and...
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You might think that is true but right now call Motorola and ask them if it has been disabled and they say not to their knowledge. I think calling a manufacturer of a phone should be good enough. What would you do if you called Ford and asked them f...
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60660

Jan 18, 2005, 10:34 PM

What's The Big Fuss Over VZW???

Now, I can understand that people are mad that VZW is selling a phone that is not capable of certain file transfers that work with other carriers( US Cellular & Alltel), but the fact of the matter is, if the bluetooth working 100% on the Moto 710 was so important to any of them, then it was their responsibility to make sure of that before they bought it. For those of them that bought it and were told by either VZW or Motorola that the crippled bluetooth on the 710 would soon be fixed, it was still their responsibility to return it before their trial period was over if that turned out to be false. No one forced any of them to stay with VZW. Plus, what are any of them going to receive out of the lawsuit?? No compensation will be put into THEIR...
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60660 said:
With all the other REAL problems going on in the world, so many people here seemed to be concerned with the bluetooth on the Moto 710???? Rolling Eyes I'm out!!


Seriously. The only thing I want to comment o...
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My main point was that it is the consumer's responsibility to make sure they know that the product they bought does what they want. If it doesn't, VZW gives you a trial period to cancel and return. If you think they are full of crap for introducing th...
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you read this website and i am guessing others like it, so you know what is going on. if you look at the page verizon has (or had) for the phone there is nothing telling you it is limited bluetooth functionality. if you read their info and had a worki...
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gjh311

Jan 20, 2005, 10:34 AM

Idiots.....all of VZW customers

You all have too much speculative time on your hands...plain and simple...you got a crappy phone....so what....if you read the VZW website...and had done your research....it does say what bluetooth profiles are supported.....so get a life and quit your complaining.
gjh311 said:
You all have too much speculative time on your hands...plain and simple...you got a crappy phone....so what....if you read the VZW website...and had done your research....it does say what bluetooth profiles are support
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The point is....once anyone found out the phone could not do what they thought it could, why not return it while they had a chance during the trial period?? That would have saved everyone all the drama. If VZW and/or Motorola said they would fix it la...
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at first the Verizon site did not have the section explaining what bluetooth profiles were supported, and it had a line about how you can use bluetooth "to connect to your handheld or desktop PC any time without wires". at no point did they explain yo...
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PhoenixAshes

Jan 19, 2005, 9:44 AM

Ok this is ridiclous

So.... the next 50 posters get the "I'm a big loser, and have nothing better to do that speculate on legal issues" award.
PhoenixAshes said:
So.... the next 50 posters get the "I'm a big loser, and have nothing better to do that speculate on legal issues" award.
But it's so entertaining when idiots speculate on the law.
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I have lots of better things to do...but they are not as fun as speculating about Verizon getting sued over bluetooth!
dj nicc

Jan 17, 2005, 4:16 PM

In the middle

On one hand I can understand a customer being upset about something they were told by a company that provides them service, you trust what they tell you, after all they are the experts........BUT.........I also understand on the business side that you have to be on ur P'S and Q's nowadays with everything, read the fine print, take the time to ask the questions.
Wink
Buyer Beware, as they say...
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lexical

Jan 17, 2005, 3:29 PM

Rant and more Rant

While we're suing VZW, lets sue some other people. Sue Disney because they didn't tell you Space Mountain would make you throw up. Sue Microsoft because they "make" you give them money for a new version of Windows. Sue McDonalds because you ate too much of their food and got fat and they didn't tell you that. Wendy's can get it too. Sue you're minister because you're still a sinner or not quite saved. Sue you car dealer because they didn't tell you gas would go up in price after you got that car. And, while youre at it, sue your parents because they didn't tell you life could be hard, isn't fair, and that **** HAPPENS. Call Johnny ****rain dammit Rolling Eyes
Exactly. While they're at it they should sue Hyundai for making a car thats not as fast as a Ferrari. I like the car dealer/gas comparison. That hits it right on the head.
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Oh yeah... Watch out Wal-Mart and you big box stores... you're next Twisted Evil
We've already got a pretty good list going.

I'm suing McDs for not telling me the coffee was hot. Oops, that one was already taken. Ummmmmm, what else????? I'm suing Phillip Morris for not telling me that inhaling SMOKE is bad for me, damn it that ...
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lexical said:
While we're suing VZW, lets sue some other people. Sue Disney because they didn't tell you Space Mountain would make you throw up. Sue Microsoft because they "make" you give them money for a new version of Windows.
...
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Stevo2k4

Jan 17, 2005, 3:56 PM

Relax and think this one through...

I think the people who post here should relax a seconda and think this one through...

Obviously this is a hot topic with nearly 50 messages on this news article. Why? T-mobile got hacked and secret service files were in the open, but techy nerds (no offense as I'm one of them) have such contempt for VzW, they are more concerned with this class action suit about the features of one particular phone model..?

Let's look at the facts...

"connect to your PC or PDA whenever and wherever you want"

This statement as advertised requires what? The phone to be capable to "connect to your PC or PDA," right? Well, it does...
The only thing that's disabled is OBEX - three bluetooth profiles are enabled, and a PAN is utilized, therefore, t...
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Stevo2k4 said:
I think the people who post here should relax a seconda and think this one through...

Obviously this is a hot topic with nearly 50 messages on this news article. Why? T-mobile got hacked and secret service files
...
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Wow... as an update... there are 125 posts on the topic (the most on any news subject in a long time) and all of this in just over 3 hours. What a heated topic...

~Steve
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Verizon is one of, if not the, most expensive cell phone companies. They have enough subscriber base that they can easily afford the decrease in Brew usage created by a fully functional bluetooth phone. Smaller carriers allow it, and still remain prof...
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W00t! Nice post!
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Stevo2k4 said:
I mean, one day maybe UNICEF will get into the wireless industry, but until then, tens of millions of people think VzW is the place to go.



This whole post was great, but this line was far and awa...
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I don't agree with your comment Steve. I think you're not appreciating the whole situation here, and the fact that many of us were "burned" and misled as consumers.

For one, you need to look at the underlying reason as to why the Bluetooth was dis...
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akaszuba

Jan 20, 2005, 12:59 PM

It's not hard to find.......

that page was not there when the phone was first for sale. it's a reaction to all the sites (like this) or even the WSJ article blasting the misleading sales pitch from VZW.

saying that page is there now and that people should cope is like laughin...
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BigRob

Jan 17, 2005, 5:25 PM

In disbelief

I just can't believe people are here supporting Verizon. I remember when this phone came out they said you could connect it to your computer, and I wanted one myself. I think it's perfectly fine for people to assume that the bluetooth on this phone allowed for them to transfer files. There isn't anything telling you different about it. Verizon knew exactly what they were doing. They knew if they said it couldn't sync with you computer they wouldn't sell many of these handicapped phones. I'm sure not a single sales rep told anyone it dind't work. Verizon is finally getting what they deserved. I'm am canceling my account with them tonight and eating the ETF. I'm tired of there BS. I have a AWS/Cingular acciount and it gets me better reception ...
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About time... Just take the ETF and be done with it. I have VZW and Cingular, and I am just riding out my VZW contract. Yes, VZW said "connect to you computer", and yes those who know about BT expected OBEX profile support. Those who didn't were li...
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BigRob said:
I think it's perfectly fine for people to assume that the bluetooth on this phone allowed for them to transfer files.


Anytime people rest on thier own assumptions they have no one to blame but themsel...
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BigRob said:
I just can't believe people are here supporting Verizon. I remember when this phone came out they said you could connect it to your computer, and I wanted one myself. I think it's perfectly fine for people to assume th
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Zaniphan

Jan 22, 2005, 11:31 AM

Tug-Of-War?

Is it just me or does this disccussion seem like an endless tug-of-war? Both sides pulling just as hard, but neither gaining any ground. Oh well, at least its fun Razz

P.S.: I'm on the "Lawsuit is Bogus" side.


P.S.: I'm on the "Lawsuit is Bogus" side.
That would make you one of the more informed posters.
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